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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Kavanagh wrote:
I cant believe that this is a matter for debate. I really feel that I am in the Twilight Zone. This has been a legitimate tactic as far back as I can remember. It actually used be more common, when there were fewer ss channels.



Yeah, but "back in the day" Mombot did not exist, so no big whoop if we did find the enemy SS channel.

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Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:15 am
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Cruncher wrote:
Kavanagh wrote:
I cant believe that this is a matter for debate. I really feel that I am in the Twilight Zone. This has been a legitimate tactic as far back as I can remember. It actually used be more common, when there were fewer ss channels.



Yeah, but "back in the day" Mombot did not exist, so no big whoop if we did find the enemy SS channel.


Again with the Inaccurate Descriptions from"back in the day" You are as usual INCORRECT.... Back in the Day if We found a Enemy SS channel it was a Fantastic Find!!! Again you are telling stories about "Back in the day" As if me and Kavanagh Were NOT there. What you just stated is completly inaccurate it was a Very BIG WHOOP regardless of the lack of having mombot. Maybe you should stick to Aborting other players Displays.

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Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:26 am
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Cruncher wrote:
Kavanagh wrote:
I cant believe that this is a matter for debate. I really feel that I am in the Twilight Zone. This has been a legitimate tactic as far back as I can remember. It actually used be more common, when there were fewer ss channels.



Yeah, but "back in the day" Mombot did not exist, so no big whoop if we did find the enemy SS channel.






You couldnt even change your SS chan. Why are you even in this topic?


Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:42 am
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Singularity wrote:
Kavanagh wrote:
I cant believe that this is a matter for debate. I really feel that I am in the Twilight Zone. This has been a legitimate tactic as far back as I can remember. It actually used be more common, when there were fewer ss channels.


It really isn't being debated right now. Back in HHT, we
screwed around with a burster to send a message to
every SS. Why? To screw up enemy coordination during
their red setup. And it worked, it had them in such a
panic that I was able to find their reds and torp them
on day 1.

Now, big D, who moaned and complained about how
it was cheating, and how HE'd never use such a tactic,
ever, has decided to use the tactic after-all.


I still don't think that it's a moral tactic. But if you would have taken the time to read what I posted, you would have understood what I said.
If I think my competition is low enough to use it first, I will use any tactic that I presume they will use against me. If someone nukes me, then they best be prepared to get nuked back.


Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:12 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Big D wrote:
I still don't think that it's a moral tactic. But if you would have taken the time to read what I posted, you would have understood what I said.


So, you routinely do things you think are immoral just
because others do them too?

ROTFLOL

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Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:14 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Space Ghost wrote:
The Question is about the Change in Viewpoint from
BigD wrote:
I'm also saying that IS cheating and only the lowest form of TW player would actually do it.
To the Extreme Opposite Soley based on What the Auther says is or isnt Bug Use or Cheating. I simply wanted to understand the massive swing from BigD from one side of the "moral" issue to the other. I wanted to compare it to other things that the Auther of the Software Doesnt Agree with that we as a Player Base use in playing the game from day to day. I have gained valuable insight with the Replies from all parties including BigD's.I now consider myself more informed. As anyone who reads the Responses should also feel.

As a bright Shinning Example BigD and others have shown..........

Time Tells ALL Tales.



A lot of things have changed. You of all people should know that time changes things a great deal. After the initial discussion on this topic and AFTER the above quote, the owner of this game says "Subspace Crawling is part of the game" Guess what, just like megarob is part of the game now, so is subspace crawling. So I'd suggest that everyone upgrade thier bots and scripts to accomadate the change. We've done so, so should your corp.


Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:16 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Singularity wrote:
Big D wrote:
I still don't think that it's a moral tactic. But if you would have taken the time to read what I posted, you would have understood what I said.


So, you routinely do things you think are immoral just
because others do them too?

ROTFLOL


You hit the nail on the head. If immoral tactics are called for, immoral tactics will be used. Same thing you would do my man.


Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:17 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Big D wrote:
You hit the nail on the head. If immoral tactics are called for, immoral tactics will be used. Same thing you would do my man.


Uhm, no. See here's the thing. If I thought it was
immoral, I wouldn't do it regardless of the situation.

For instance: rape. I think it's immoral, thus I don't
go around raping people.

I don't justify it by the situation... "oh, well, but she
was going to rape me first! So I had to!"

The reason I might use a subspace crawler is because
I don't consider it immoral. If I did, I wouldn't use it.

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1. TWGS server @ twgs.navhaz.com
2. The NavHaz Junction - Tradewars 2002 Scripts, Resources and Downloads
3. Open IRC chat @ irc.freenode.net:6667 #twchan
4. Parrothead wrote: Jesus wouldn't Subspace Crawl.

*** SG memorial donations via paypal to: dpocky68@booinc.com
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Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:29 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Kavanagh wrote:
I cant believe that this is a matter for debate. I really feel that I am in the Twilight Zone. This has been a legitimate tactic as far back as I can remember. It actually used be more common, when there were fewer ss channels.


I'm glad a lot of people feel that way since I'm going to be on Boo Inc.'s sub channel more than I will on our SS channel. BTW, I noticed that Kraakens subspace channel was listed in my hit file too, but I didn't monitor that channel because they haven't tried to subspace crawl us in the ICE tourney.


Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:33 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Singularity wrote:
Big D wrote:
You hit the nail on the head. If immoral tactics are called for, immoral tactics will be used. Same thing you would do my man.


Uhm, no. See here's the thing. If I thought it was
immoral, I wouldn't do it regardless of the situation.

For instance: rape. I think it's immoral, thus I don't
go around raping people.

I don't justify it by the situation... "oh, well, but she
was going to rape me first! So I had to!"

The reason I might use a subspace crawler is because
I don't consider it immoral. If I did, I wouldn't use it.


I answered your question did you not understand? Let me make it a bit clearer to you.

"YES, I will use an immoral tactic against a corp or player that chooses to use immoral tactics against me or my corp. Got it? Helix hit our subspace channel 1st in this game, so I am doing the same thing to him and his corp only better. :P


Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:36 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Big D wrote:
Space Ghost wrote:
The Question is about the Change in Viewpoint from
BigD wrote:
I'm also saying that IS cheating and only the lowest form of TW player would actually do it.
To the Extreme Opposite Soley based on What the Auther says is or isnt Bug Use or Cheating. I simply wanted to understand the massive swing from BigD from one side of the "moral" issue to the other. I wanted to compare it to other things that the Auther of the Software Doesnt Agree with that we as a Player Base use in playing the game from day to day. I have gained valuable insight with the Replies from all parties including BigD's.I now consider myself more informed. As anyone who reads the Responses should also feel.

As a bright Shinning Example BigD and others have shown..........

Time Tells ALL Tales.



A lot of things have changed. You of all people should know that time changes things a great deal. After the initial discussion on this topic and AFTER the above quote, the owner of this game says "Subspace Crawling is part of the game" Guess what, just like megarob is part of the game now, so is subspace crawling. So I'd suggest that everyone upgrade thier bots and scripts to accomadate the change. We've done so, so should your corp.


Well Time didnt really change anything...Its been what 60 days since that quote?

The Owner of the Software has came out and stated that riding a planets shields is BUG use...and by vrey definition people who used the tactic would have to be considered "Bug" users and cheaters. Does this mean that BigD will not proclaim those who use this tactic "Cheaters" ??

Some people (like t0yman) have the power of thier Convictions and would never be a part of something they thought was wrong or immoral. They would rather quit and move on to a different game then stoop to the level of their competition (escpecially after calling then cheaters).
Other people Who Do not have thier power of thier of thier own convictions Would simply believe "When in Rome" etc etc And Still others Would have never cried "Cheater" and continues on thier way Without ever muttering a word about it. I am honored that you took the time to answer my question and express your views. I belive SubSpace terrrorism has been around as long as the game itself and was widely accepted as a tactic LONG before you accused Helix of being a Cheater. Programs Such as TWAR DOS had SubSpace Scramblers as far back as i can remember.

But this doesnt really answer the underlyng Question of What about OTHER tactics that the OWNER of this software says is BUG use. Is the Owner of the Software the finale authority or is more a "Idon't like losing to Helix so I'll Call him a Cheater" type of thing??

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Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:44 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
I'm done with this conversation. Boo Inc. used this tactic first, and can expect to have the same tactic used against them in this tourney and in all future tournies. Deal with it.


Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:53 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Big D wrote:
"YES, I will use an immoral tactic against a corp or player that chooses to use immoral tactics against me or my corp. Got it? Helix hit our subspace channel 1st in this game, so I am doing the same thing to him and his corp only better. :P


Yes, but that makes you an immoral person.

If one person does something, but doesn't consider
it immoral, then they aren't breaking their code of
morality are they? You might not like the tactic, you
might consider it immoral, but they are at least
consistent with their own morality.

On the other hand, you have a tactic you consider
immoral, but is used against you. Does that justify
your use of that tactic? No, because it breaks your
own code of morality.

What you're saying is that you're willing to do immoral
things if they're done to you first. That reduces all of
your morality to nonsense, because you have no
principles to base them upon. Quid pro quo is not a
moral behavior, nor does it justify your actions.

For me, there are things I consider immoral and won't
do, and things I don't consider immoral. I don't consider
SS crawling immoral, why would I? I do, however,
consider many other things immoral and don't do them
regardless of whether they're done to me.

Just because they used the tactic against you first, does
not mean you should use the tactic against them next.
If you consider it immoral, you should refuse to use the
tactic in all situations regardless. Otherwise, you need
to revise your code of morals.

I don't care if you use it against boo inc in the future,
that's not even a problem nor the point of this post. The
point of this post is to point out the flaws in your morality.
To demonstrate the obvious hypocrisy in your claims.

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May the unholy fires of corbomite ignite deep within the depths of your soul...

1. TWGS server @ twgs.navhaz.com
2. The NavHaz Junction - Tradewars 2002 Scripts, Resources and Downloads
3. Open IRC chat @ irc.freenode.net:6667 #twchan
4. Parrothead wrote: Jesus wouldn't Subspace Crawl.

*** SG memorial donations via paypal to: dpocky68@booinc.com
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Tue Jan 11, 2011 12:58 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Big D wrote:
I'm done with this conversation. Boo Inc. used this tactic first, and can expect to have the same tactic used against them in this tourney and in all future tournies. Deal with it.


I'm honored that you took the time to express your views in such detail, Thanks Again.

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Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:00 pm
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Unread post Re: Sub Space Crawler Supreme
Please move this thread to smack talk. Thank you.


Tue Jan 11, 2011 1:29 pm
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