Kill the port? Bad form or good strategy
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Admin 1
Site Admin
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2000 3:00 am Posts: 1432 Location: USA
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Uncle Sam wrote: Well lets see the "paragons of TW virtue" your term not mine. I know no knowledge of anyone's virtue.
The players I have corp'd with or against that I thought were honorable are as follows:
Jhereg Overkill Tweety xide Jerry Diddy Animal
Those are just a few off the top you might have known or heard of. And there are others not so well known. But to my knowledge they never resorted to what I call lame Butt tactics continually to win. They used hard work a lot of experimentation and a little luck!
And at no point have I stated that blowing of ports is broken rule. Or the saying of someones home sector over fed. BUT, in my "opinion" its lame. So is spamming people....LAME.
If I win I want it to be because I worked harder or made better decisions than the other teams. Not because I resorted to letting others do my dirty work or out right cheating to win. I realize that is not important to some, but to me it is.
well i know tweety did it...HHT 00 i think.
Hekate had a freaking cow about it at the time.
Xide and Diddy wouldnt hesitate inmho but i'd have to research an actual event.
I guess my point was all this finger pointing at me. And I'd bet most of your hero's would do no less then I.
I would pop a port if it was in anyway to my better intrest.
This whole ole SG is playing for a stalemate and you with your Ruining another game BS..I mean i know there is a reason i never change my Signature here on eis but Dang.
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:30 pm |
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Admin 1
Site Admin
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2000 3:00 am Posts: 1432 Location: USA
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Parrothead wrote: baited wrote: So are you saying now that we got on itcq and got a member of anouther corp? You keep dancing around, did SG's corp Megacorp? and if so HOW? thats all I want to know. Dude it was dealt with at the time. Peeps involved admitted it and sent regrets. Ceo of second corp knows all about it and dealt with his corpie as he saw fit. No real harm was done. This has been all out in the open from 5 minutes after it happened so. Either you didnt know it was going on or were not told it was. You will have to take that up with your CEO. Pretending it did not go on after open confessions to it is moot.
Parrot what the hell you talking about?
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:31 pm |
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Baited
Lieutenant
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 3:00 am Posts: 588 Location: USA
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Parrothead wrote: baited wrote: So are you saying now that we got on itcq and got a member of anouther corp? You keep dancing around, did SG's corp Megacorp? and if so HOW? thats all I want to know. Dude it was dealt with at the time. Peeps involved admitted it and sent regrets. Ceo of second corp knows all about it and dealt with his corpie as he saw fit. No real harm was done. This has been all out in the open from 5 minutes after it happened so. Either you didnt know it was going on or were not told it was. You will have to take that up with your CEO. Pretending it did not go on after open confessions to it is moot.
So your answer being not very direct is yes you say we Megacorped, and no you won't say when,how, or provide any proof. I have to say I did expect this type of answer from newb, just thought you were growing out of that. Guess I was wrong. Next time you bring an allogation up, bring proof so you don't look so much like an idiot when you can't back it up.
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:39 pm |
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Stockton
Lieutenant
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 3:00 am Posts: 589 Location: USA
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Uncle Sam wrote: Well lets see the "paragons of TW virtue" your term not mine. I know no knowledge of anyone's virtue.
The players I have corp'd with or against that I thought were honorable are as follows:
Jhereg Overkill Tweety xide Jerry Diddy Animal
Those are just a few off the top you might have known or heard of. And there are others not so well known. But to my knowledge they never resorted to what I call lame Butt tactics continually to win. They used hard work a lot of experimentation and a little luck!
And at no point have I stated that blowing of ports is broken rule. Or the saying of someones home sector over fed. BUT, in my "opinion" its lame. So is spamming people....LAME.
If I win I want it to be because I worked harder or made better decisions than the other teams. Not because I resorted to letting others do my dirty work or out right cheating to win. I realize that is not important to some, but to me it is.
Like when Jhereg exploited a bug in Oz's bot that only oz and himself knew about it? Making RR's bot cby? Ya that was pretty honorable!
_________________ CYA at extern!
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:23 pm |
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Kavanagh
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 1410 Location: Boo! inc. Ireland
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Singularity wrote: Laff, I've played quite a few team sports. Using hands in soccer is considered unethical if you're the not the goalie, meanwhile in baseball it's all the rage. The only "ethics" that pervade both is when the other team stomps your face... you don't whine and cry about cheating or ethics, you go over and shake their hand and say "Good game."
Self-righteousness is not an ethic. A constant need to assume a moral highground is a moral weakness, IMO. It suggests a weakness of exactly that, ie: methinks thou dost protest too much. One man's values need not be another's, and there is no such thing as a unified "good" sense of ethics. Ethics are completely subjective, across time and culture. Every game has it's own sense of sportsmanship and "fair play." And every player has their own sense of what is fair within those bounds. That's why there are rules, to keep play according to the defined spirit of the game.
IMO, fairness is a weakness. Life isn't fair, in any way shape or form. Some things may cross the line of gamesmanship, those that don't are fair enough.
So anyway, who exactly are all these paragons of TW virtue you were talking about earlier?
Using "hands" in soccer is not unethical. It is against the rules except in limited circumstances.
Easy to spot a transgression.
FYI, its not just using "hands" thats prohibited. Any part of an arm (below the shoulder) cannot be used to touch the ball.
I'd sooner watch a good pool game.
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:48 pm |
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Big D
Veteran Op
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:04 pm Posts: 5025
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Uncle Sam wrote: Well lets see the "paragons of TW virtue" your term not mine. I know no knowledge of anyone's virtue.
The players I have corp'd with or against that I thought were honorable are as follows:
Jhereg Overkill Tweety xide Jerry Diddy Animal
Those are just a few off the top you might have known or heard of. And there are others not so well known. But to my knowledge they never resorted to what I call lame Butt tactics continually to win. They used hard work a lot of experimentation and a little luck!
And at no point have I stated that blowing of ports is broken rule. Or the saying of someones home sector over fed. BUT, in my "opinion" its lame. So is spamming people....LAME.
If I win I want it to be because I worked harder or made better decisions than the other teams. Not because I resorted to letting others do my dirty work or out right cheating to win. I realize that is not important to some, but to me it is.
There are several tactics I miyself wouldn't use in a game, however; I can't justify saying I'm morally superior than them either. As far as your term cheating, that is absolute nonsense. You can't cheat if the game allows it. There are no cheat codes for tradewars, so it can't be cheating. Basically you are demoralizing all those that disagree with you. and that in my opinion is "Poor sportsmanship". You didn't hear me accusing you of cheating when you found us. By the way, Good game.
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:55 pm |
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Big D
Veteran Op
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:04 pm Posts: 5025
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Kavanagh wrote: Singularity wrote: Laff, I've played quite a few team sports. Using hands in soccer is considered unethical if you're the not the goalie, meanwhile in baseball it's all the rage. The only "ethics" that pervade both is when the other team stomps your face... you don't whine and cry about cheating or ethics, you go over and shake their hand and say "Good game."
Self-righteousness is not an ethic. A constant need to assume a moral highground is a moral weakness, IMO. It suggests a weakness of exactly that, ie: methinks thou dost protest too much. One man's values need not be another's, and there is no such thing as a unified "good" sense of ethics. Ethics are completely subjective, across time and culture. Every game has it's own sense of sportsmanship and "fair play." And every player has their own sense of what is fair within those bounds. That's why there are rules, to keep play according to the defined spirit of the game.
IMO, fairness is a weakness. Life isn't fair, in any way shape or form. Some things may cross the line of gamesmanship, those that don't are fair enough.
So anyway, who exactly are all these paragons of TW virtue you were talking about earlier? Using "hands" in soccer is not unethical. It is against the rules except in limited circumstances. Easy to spot a transgression. FYI, its not just using "hands" thats prohibited. Any part of an arm (below the shoulder) cannot be used to touch the ball. I'd sooner watch a good pool game.
You seem to know a lot about the game. I suppose you call it "Football" too. lol
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:59 pm |
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LoRD TaLoN
Chief Warrant Officer
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 127 Location: Ashland, Ky, USA
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Parrothead wrote: <FONT>Well port blowing was not the issue with me...as blowing ports for whatever reason is in the game.The issue was that the corp that responding to the port blowing (well actually that was an after thought to cover up info sharing as they showed up brfore the port was blown) did not show up to attack the corp but to protect the other corp. Therefore such actions result in megacorping. If megacorping is to be allowed then simply leave the corp member limit set to unlimited and we can all round up peeps. So lets not confuse the issue or pretend what happened didnt. You let everyone know your playing for a stalemate SG but your not going to get one...once you and your corp are gone from the game their might be one.
Parrot you need to learn to think before you speak. I personally don't even condone going to try to invade someone by means of info being blurted into the logs via a port being blown. Let alone info sharing or megacorping. I did not condone any of that. Your lumping both teams into one big pool here. And i made that very clear in at least 3 msgs on fedspace, and several messages to team on subspace. So quite generalizing please.
_________________ -99.9% retired from tradewars unless a very special occasion arises- --Will still be around though to interact socially with my old friends-- ---You may contact me via icq, or email, both listed in my profile---
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 11:03 pm |
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Kavanagh
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 1410 Location: Boo! inc. Ireland
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Big D wrote: Uncle Sam wrote: Well lets see the "paragons of TW virtue" your term not mine. I know no knowledge of anyone's virtue. The players I have corp'd with or against that I thought were honorable are as follows: Jhereg Overkill Tweety xide Jerry Diddy Animal Those are just a few off the top you might have known or heard of. And there are others not so well known. But to my knowledge they never resorted to what I call lame Butt tactics continually to win. They used hard work a lot of experimentation and a little luck! And at no point have I stated that blowing of ports is broken rule. Or the saying of someones home sector over fed. BUT, in my "opinion" its lame. So is spamming people....LAME. If I win I want it to be because I worked harder or made better decisions than the other teams. Not because I resorted to letting others do my dirty work or out right cheating to win. I realize that is not important to some, but to me it is. There are several tactics I miyself wouldn't use in a game, however; I can't justify saying I'm morally superior than them either. As far as your term cheating, that is absolute nonsense. You can't cheat if the game allows it. There are no cheat codes for tradewars, so it can't be cheating. Basically you are demoralizing all those that disagree with you. and that in my opinion is "Poor sportsmanship". You didn't hear me accusing you of cheating when you found us. By the way, Good game.
I agree completely. If the game permits it, it is ok by me, do not whine, simple solution: If you don't like some tactics that people use, game after game, do not play with/against them.
It is Darn near impossible to police gameop imposed rules impartially.
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 11:05 pm |
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MisBehavin
Lieutenant J.G.
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 2:00 am Posts: 474 Location: USA
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Everyone views things differently. whats unethical to one may not be to another.
I myself am game for just about anything except logging in someones account and stealing thier stuff.
However, if I play with ppl who are not as open to "unethical tactics" then I wouldn't do them just as a courtesy to corping with them.
_________________ chat @ irc.freenode.net:6667 #twchan
*** SG memorial donations via paypal to: dpocky68@booinc.com
**http://wiki.classictw.com/index.php?title=Main_Page **http://web.archive.org/web/19980610181412/http://www.azi.com/
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| Mon Mar 26, 2007 11:45 pm |
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Big D
Veteran Op
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:04 pm Posts: 5025
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MisBehavin wrote: Everyone views things differently. whats unethical to one may not be to another.
I myself am game for just about anything except logging in someones account and stealing thier stuff.
However, if I play with ppl who are not as open to "unethical tactics" then I wouldn't do them just as a courtesy to corping with them.
Breaking into ones acount is more than unethical, it is cheating. Since there is a safeguard for doing so in the sense that it is password protected. There is one thing that really urks me that is allowable in the game. That is backstabbing. From what I just stated, it is part of game play, but in my opinion about the worst thing a player can do. I will kill known dupes in a game, I will chase backstabbers down and kill them in every game I see them in. It's thier choice to backstab, it's my choice to hound them for eternity. lol
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| Tue Mar 27, 2007 12:55 am |
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Daala
Gameop
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 2:00 am Posts: 112 Location: In my bubble...
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Cernnunos wrote: I was just pointing out the definition of mega-corping. We beat this to death a short while ago when a trader used another corp to moth for them. And if it is not against the rules where the game is then it becomes a viable tactic. Maybe not a savory tactic but a viable one none the less.What matters are the server rules. Go to Vulcan's and Mega Corping is against the rules, go to Outpost and it is not against the rules.
The fact it is not in our rules does not mean we allow it. We don't have the luxury to keep tabs on every "issue" someone has and make a rule for it. It was a general rule that we had assumed most followed, and if we were wrong, then maybe we need to make it a rule in a physical form.
For the record, you are the only person to bring up "mega-corping" on our site in the last 4 years of Thrawn and I hosting.
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| Tue Mar 27, 2007 12:58 am |
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Kavanagh
Ambassador
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 3:00 am Posts: 1410 Location: Boo! inc. Ireland
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Big D wrote: Kavanagh wrote: Singularity wrote: Laff, I've played quite a few team sports. Using hands in soccer is considered unethical if you're the not the goalie, meanwhile in baseball it's all the rage. The only "ethics" that pervade both is when the other team stomps your face... you don't whine and cry about cheating or ethics, you go over and shake their hand and say "Good game." Self-righteousness is not an ethic. A constant need to assume a moral highground is a moral weakness, IMO. It suggests a weakness of exactly that, ie: methinks thou dost protest too much. One man's values need not be another's, and there is no such thing as a unified "good" sense of ethics. Ethics are completely subjective, across time and culture. Every game has it's own sense of sportsmanship and "fair play." And every player has their own sense of what is fair within those bounds. That's why there are rules, to keep play according to the defined spirit of the game. IMO, fairness is a weakness. Life isn't fair, in any way shape or form. Some things may cross the line of gamesmanship, those that don't are fair enough. So anyway, who exactly are all these paragons of TW virtue you were talking about earlier? Using "hands" in soccer is not unethical. It is against the rules except in limited circumstances. Easy to spot a transgression. FYI, its not just using "hands" thats prohibited. Any part of an arm (below the shoulder) cannot be used to touch the ball. I'd sooner watch a good pool game. You seem to know a lot about the game. I suppose you call it "Football" too. lol
Nope, but at least they use a spherical shape (ball).
Football - Gaelic Football. Hands ok, head, arms etc. for the ball. Permitted to tackle another player, if he is in possesion of the ball. Body armor not permitted, crash the wrong way, too bad. None of the sudden stops and girlie signals the Yanks use, grin.
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| Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:16 am |
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Cerne
Gameop
Joined: Sun Oct 08, 2006 2:00 am Posts: 991
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Sariss wrote: For the record, you are the only person to bring up "mega-corping" on our site in the last 4 years of Thrawn and I hosting. Have you read the thread in question? http://www.classictw.com/forum/forum_po ... ?TID=18591Cerne
_________________ "All warfare is based on deception..." - Art of War "Time will tell all tales" - SG Any advanced tactic in TW is indistinguishable from cheating.
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| Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:25 am |
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Parrothead
Commander
Joined: Wed May 03, 2006 2:00 am Posts: 1722 Location: USA
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Chicken Gearge wrote: I got destroyed by a bird now I must retire.
yes Stocky Its sad but true.
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| Tue Mar 27, 2007 3:29 am |
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