I was talking to Rincrast and found out some intresting news, I have wondered in the recent past why Stonewall of the Deep South (http://www.thedeepsouth.org) has not been apart of the community, it seems like since the build and formation of the TW League he hasnt been around that much, and today I found out why, he has been wraping up things before he is sent off to Iraq...

I here by send out a prayer to Stonewall, and many hopes that he will make it home alive, safe, and well. And my prayers go out to all of you defending the United States Of America. While I do not agree with the war in Iraq, and I believe that American soilders are dieing in vain, I still want to show support for those who serve this great country of ours.

God bless...
P.S: If this has already been posted, or sent out, many apologies, just wanted to show my respect and hope for those who risk their lives for the freedom of all...

He just left, actually. But yes, we should pray for him.

Rin

Ender, i believe the thousands of people freed from torture chambers and the millions freed from dictatorship are happy Bush won office and not you...

yes stockton.. because this country has never been known for torturing people in war countries. and judging by a lot of the peoples reaction to our troops there.. perhaps they do not want to be "freed" from the "torture chambers" or the dictatorship.. oh maybe because we brought the torture chambers there!

And the thousands of Americans dead? How about their families?? And the thousands more that must die? How about all the dead Iraqi women and childern due to American military "mistakes" and "mishaps"? There are better ways to handle things these days, the backyard killing days are over, diplomacy does work these days...

ya diplomacy with saddam, he has showed a real willingness to work with us in the past 10 years, and im sure our solid allies france and germany would of put pressure on them when they are wrapped up in their own scandals with iraq.. ghoury, sunnis seem to be the only people who are showing resistance despite all attempts by the new government to include them in the new system.. cya at KI

oh i forgot who put saddam in power.. can you remind me?

Oh and I forgot! The "REASON" we took Suddam out of power was becuase he had WMD! Weapons-of-mass-imagination! Bush, the biggest terrorist in the world. Politics, dont get me started...

Bush lied, morhped his story, it started off;
"We have to invade now, Iraq is stockpiling weapons of mass destruction. Capable of doing harm to many of its neighbors allied with us"

When his lie was discovered he morhped!
"Well atleast a killer and terrorist is out of power in Iraq"

Bush, has a good way of doing things like that.
Mighty Morhping Bush!

Yes this was the case of the Weapons of Mass Destruction. Also remember this, when Bush wanted to go in when he saw this the UN delayed his attempt to catch Saddam with his weapons, and the amount of delay gave Saddam a window of time to move them out or hide them better, who is to say what our troops would have found if the UN let us go in at the first, when Bush wanted to go in,I am a former soldier and also have my prayers out to Stonewall, I was keeping in touch with him up until he got sent off, Rincrast, know he will be missed during the time he is gone, if possible keep us posted on how he is doing.

Now let us all pray for a friend...


Vulcan

ender, we are both young, and none of us know what is going on so dont pretend like you are some intellectual and political expert.. u dont know wht the F you are talking about.. just stick to thinks u know like pissing people off in TW and dont run your mouth on global situations to which u have no CLUE on waht needs to be done to secure america.. and seriouisly F the women and children of iraq, im worried about the women and children of america

Ok, you got my attention. I'm sure the bashing will begin shortly after this post. Go ahead, take your best shot. I'm more than use to the Canuck bashing when it comes to the topic of war. But seriously, aside from my personal feelings about the war in Iraq, There are far more deadly forces at work globally today, than the "Target practice" the U.S forces are currently conducting in the Middle East. For God's sake, if there was ever a country that posed such an insignificant threat the North America as a whole, it was defiantly Iraq. Those poor bastards don’t even have an air force to speak of let alone a navy that would allow them to launch a pre-emptive strike on America. You should be wasting your ammunition somewhere else (I leave my suggestion for another day).
All politicians are crooks (including ours) but for the love of god, I wish they would unscrew their heads from their asses and come to grips with reality.

Zoso

ok zoso a few points, noone thougt that iraq could launch an attack against us in the tradional army vs army battle.. but in an age of terrorism saddam was very much a threat because he could and did work with terrorists and supply them with weapons that could harm us or our assets.. ender to your point on no weapons, well i guess bush should of asked u if they were there enstead of trusting every inteligence service in the world that all said he had weapons, just as vulcan stated, he had pleanty of time to bury or move any weapons that may have been there, but even if your right and there wasnt one shred of weaposn there then this war was purely humanitarion like i thought u libbies like, im sure u werent complaining when clinton was dropping bombs in yugoslavia killing innocent women and children,,. i for one am glad bush used the intelligence that he was given and understood the threat saddam was, we know saddam wants to hurt the U.S he tried to assasinate former president bush,, gassed his own people, attacked his neighbors, etc.. but just because u want to attack bush u paint a picture as if iraq was this insignificant country that poses no threat and didnt lead by brutality.. its sad that u let your political views blind you from what needs to be done in a world after 9-11... let me ask u this, We know that every intelligence service said there were weapons.. would you not have attacked bush if he did nothing about that after iraq had violated u.n sanction after u.n sanction? i think u would of.. are we not safer now with a government in iraq that will work with us over a dictator that did everything he could to avoid weapons checks and violate u.n. sanctions..

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I hope all our troops are OK too. I wish they were home. I wish I could wave a magic wand and make all of our problems go away. I just don't think praying alone is going to get them home safe and sound. If you really care about getting the troops home, send an e-mail to your congressmen and senators. Organize a protest or an e-mail campaign. Get the word out to like minded people, and encourage them to do the same. If you already have, then good job! You're done. Sit down. Have a cookie.

God helps those who help themselves. Praying and the belief that "everything is in God's hands" is just a cop-out so Christians don't have to take personal responsibility for their actions or their lack of actions. I am so sick of it. I hope there is a special hell reserved for people like that. God didn't start this war, Man did. What makes people think God is gonna help us with this one? We made this mess, it's up to us to clean it up. Sending a prayer is just wussing out at best, or an attempt to CYA at worst. When and if the reckoning comes, God will know the difference between the people that actually tried to make a difference (one way or another), and those who only paid lip service.
[/Rant]

Ender, don't take that too personal. It's more of a general rant, ok? At the very least you've taken the first step, and publicly stated your opinion. Which is more than most ever do. [:D]

I feel our point would have been better made if we had focused exclusivly on Afganastan and bagged Osama. Ya, Sadam had to go, but I think invading Iraq BEFORE we had dealt with Osama was a huge strategic mistake. Everything we did after would have been easier if we first had Osama's head on a pike. Of course, neglecting Afganastan after the Soviets pulled out was an even bigger mistake. But hey, why worry about the past? It's all in God's hands, right?

Stock, I think I can slightly understand how Americans must feel Post 9-11 (I said slightly). However, even the most organized terrorists (Bin Sadem ļ) can only do so much damage. Granted they did enough murdering for 1000 life times only a few short years ago, that will probably never happen again. What allowed them to successfully plan and execute what they did, was the element of surprise. I some how doubt that they will be given the same opportunity again.

quote:but in an age of terrorism saddam was very much a threat because he could and did work with terrorists and supply them with weapons that could harm us or our assets..

Like what? Sand masks? Maybe some camel riding lessons.

quote:We know that every intelligence service said there were weapons..

This is not true, both British and American (mood point - but the only two Intelligence agencies to come forward with info) agencies were stumbling to provide any real evidence of weapons, outside of some bogus satellite photos.

quote:are we not safer now with a government in iraq that will work with us over a dictator that did everything he could to avoid weapons checks and violate u.n. sanctions..

I suspect they will lose control the minute U.S forces leave in any significant number.

I guess my point is that Bin Laden was the Attacker, but the people of Iraq are paying the price? Don¡¦t think for a moment that the circle has been broken. Oh know, in fact the U.S army is perpetuating it. All those kids living everyday in fear and death are learning very quickly why there Fathers, Uncles, Grandfathers, Brothers and friends detest the U.S.

My thoughts are with all those fighting overseas. I wish them a safe return.

When a defeated agressor nation has sanctions put on them, it is imperative that they are enforced. If you let a country thumb their nose at the sanctions, you end up with Germany pre WWII.