quote:
I only provided the calculations of 1% worth of cannon firing. I also said that if the total amount of your cannons were set to a TOTAL of greater than 8%, that the invader could not survive the sector.

So you did, but you seemed to waffle back and forth, and where do you get the 1 percent from? When did I ever say I set my cannons at 1 percent???? And you scold ME for not paying attention.

quote:
It DOES NOT matter how many offensive figs you have in the sector. Pay attention right now: the sector will send 1.25 times the number of figs needed to destroy the ship as if it were fully loaded. This means that if the ship has a defensive rating higher than 1.25, it WILL NOT be podded by offensive figs alone, if it has max figs/shields.

I have never read a more erronious statement. 58 million offensive alone with no quasars in the sector will pod a ship with 1.8 defensive odds, 300k figs, and 12k shields!!! It will pod them some 9 times. Do me a favor go try it before you talk!

quote:
yes, but you cannot provide it. All you can prove is that your test server settings would work. Well, congratulations on proving something as obvious as that. Whats next? Would you like to prove that concrete is a hard, solid substance?

First of all, I can provide the proof, of course you can always say that my captures are doctored and aren't proof, so that makes me a liar right? What's really funny about this veiled accusation is that you fail to explain what my motivation would be to lie! If you review my original post I did not IDENTIFY the SITE of which I was speaking, so you can't say I was just trying to trash the site! You are just ridiculous plain and simple! Why would I lie? What possible thing would I gain from this deception?

quote:
There is a major distinction between the actual planets and these identical planets you created on a test server.
You made sure that all the test planets had full ore and that they were set to 3%. You cannot prove that your actual planets were set up like that. As I said before, it is easy to think your planets are set up right.



Again, why would I lie? What possible reason on God's green Earth would there be? I could send my corp partners in here from that site to vouch for me, but it's pointless, you'd just say they are lying too. You evidently have not comprehension skills whatsoever.

quote:
You misspelled smack.


I spelled it that way because that's the way a lot of people in the twars universe seemed to be spelling it! When in Rome! I viewed the spelling as a colloquialism, nothing more. This last comment proves my earlier assessment of you. You are ridiculous!

J. Dean,

Even I don't think you did it out of spite. As I said before I am pretty sure that I have closed and locked any back doors thanks to Harley and the others. I still maintain I did not cheat or allow others to cheat. If there was cheating going on I had no idea.

Regardless of all of this the server seems to be running quite well. I have about 20 players registered in game A and B and they seem to be doing quite well since rebang Friday night. They are version .57 MBBS gold games. You and anyone else are welcome to come join in anytime.

I understand from some of my other players it is getting really ugly in game A already. It has no rules. Some of my longer time players are leaving game A. Game B has the same settings as game A and still has rules similar to my old rules, but now allows blockading of FedSpace or SD.

That is about it for me. Thanks again to all who offered help in fixing some of the problems I've encountered.
Brian

quote:
So you did, but you seemed to waffle back and forth, and where do you get the 1 percent from? When did I ever say I set my cannons at 1 percent???? And you scold ME for not paying attention.


I used 1% because its the lowest amount. You could easily calculate a 2% by multiplying my 1% by 2, and so on. I used it to be simple.

quote:
quote:
It DOES NOT matter how many offensive figs you have in the sector. Pay attention right now: the sector will send 1.25 times the number of figs needed to destroy the ship as if it were fully loaded. This means that if the ship has a defensive rating higher than 1.25, it WILL NOT be podded by offensive figs alone, if it has max figs/shields.

I have never read a more erronious statement. 58 million offensive alone with no quasars in the sector will pod a ship with 1.8 defensive odds, 300k figs, and 12k shields!!! It will pod them some 9 times. Do me a favor go try it before you talk!


Read TW-cabal. It says exactly what i said. Also, at the end of this post, i will include a capture from me testing the very same thing.

quote:
First of all, I can provide the proof, of course you can always say that my captures are doctored and aren't proof, so that makes me a liar right? What's really funny about this veiled accusation is that you fail to explain what my motivation would be to lie! If you review my original post I did not IDENTIFY the SITE of which I was speaking, so you can't say I was just trying to trash the site! You are just ridiculous plain and simple! Why would I lie? What possible thing would I gain from this deception?


I'm not calling you a liar. The capture you provided was on a test server not the server that you are accusing of cheating. The settings you set on the test server may not be identical to what was actually on the other server. As Harley said, you are probably about 50% likely to remember exactly how it was set up.

And now for the capture of what i found. I used an ISS (1.5:1 def odds):

Command [TL=00:00:00]:[69] (?=Help)? : I
<Info>

Trader Name : Civilian player two
Rank and Exp : 0 points, Alignment=1,000 Unselfish
Corp # 2, two
Ship Name : .
Ship Info : Yokotosaki Imperial StarShip Ported=0 Kills=0
Date Built : 11:26:19 PM Sun Feb 28, 2016
Turns to Warp : 4
Current Sector : 69
Turns left : 9936
Total Holds : 20 - Empty=20
Fighters : 50,000
Shield points : 2,000
LongRange Scan : Holographic Scanner
TransWarp Power
(Type 1 Jump): 0 hops
(Type 2 Jump): 0 hops
Credits : 300

Command [TL=00:00:00]:[69] (?=Help)? : 922
<Move>
Warping to Sector 922

Sector : 922 in Vedala Erandi.
Ports : Tajarhi, Class 2 (BSB)
Planets : (H) .
Fighters: 58,000,000 (belong to player one) [Offensive]
Warps to Sector(s) : 69

Fighter Attack!
Combat computer reports damages of 43094 battle points!
41094 K3-A Fighters destroyed by the attack!

You have to destroy the fighters to remain in this sector.

Your fighters: 8,906 vs. theirs: 57,935,000
Option? (A,D,I,R,?):? R
<Retreat>
Your fighters make a valiant attempt to stall the oncoming horde.
You have 8905 fighter(s) left.

Sector : 69 in Vedala Erandi.
Ports : Sirion, Class 7 (SSS)
Warps to Sector(s) : 26 - 74 - 164 [b[- 504 - 922 - 996

Command [TL=00:00:00]:[69] (?=Help)? : I
<Info>

Trader Name : Civilian player two
Rank and Exp : 0 points, Alignment=1,000 Unselfish
Corp # 2, two
Ship Name : .
Ship Info : Yokotosaki Imperial StarShip Ported=0 Kills=0
Date Built : 11:26:19 PM Sun Feb 28, 2016
Turns to Warp : 4
Current Sector : 69
Turns left : 9928
Total Holds : 20 - Empty=20
Fighters : 8,905
LongRange Scan : Holographic Scanner
TransWarp Power
(Type 1 Jump): 0 hops
(Type 2 Jump): 0 hops
Credits : 300

O.K.,,as just a player I'm a bit confused,, TW isn't my life,,but it IS my favorite game and I play when I can,, but all this talk of cheating and such worries me.
Why don't you get together and form a sort of council that investigates claims of cheating?
It shouldn't be hard for one of you knowledgeable players to join a game and look into such claims and then post an opinion, which would give players like me something to refer to when rumors abound, like now.
I have been playing on Brians site, and have been quite happy until all this started.
Has cheating occurred? I don't know and wouldn't really have any idea unless it was VERY blatant, and I haven't seen evidence of that, but I'm not the "expert" player that most of you seem to be,, I just play, and end up somewhere in the middle of the pack when the game ends.
Will I continue to play on Brians place?
Yes, when the current games re-bang again I will play,, things are a bit too agressive at the moment and I got a late start AGAIN due to the fact that "Life" got in the way at the last minute, so I haven't abandoned the games there, just taking a break.

A coucil is a great idea on paper, but so is communism. The problem with that is A) Who wants to waste game time policing other games? and B) as Galaxi said "Any sufficiently advanced tradewars strategy is indistinguishable from cheating." There will always be people who don't understand some mechanics of the game and therfore think somethign is being done wrong. Plus while investigations are going on, games would have to be virtually halted. It's just not a plausible thing to do.

End of discussion, the point is now moot.

Arucard's formulas seem correct to me. He used TW Cabal's formulas.

Some points that make it moot:

#1 SGO can't remember exactly what the planets were set to. He recreated it on another server using what could be a higher qcannon setting.

#2 Somehow people were playing with the same IP address. Dupers if you will. Could have mothed the sectors and drained sector and planet resources.

#3 It was an older version of TWGS that could have worked a bit differently, the test server was a newer version.

#4 Should have been kept in email, no reason to involve others. Yet another Soap Opera in the TW MegaVerse.

#5 The game is over and will be rebanged. Server settings will be different next time to prevent dupers and other stuff.

Thanks dad. Can I go out and play now?

quote:Originally posted by Nomad

Thanks dad. Can I go out and play now?


Well did you learn your lesson yet? If not, go back to your room and think about what you have done.

I saw the captures posted concerning the attack of offensive fighters and I was beside myself. Ok, I guess there is actually something I don't understand about how this game works (mechanics wise). I'm not a mathematician, I only know from personal experience.

Here's what I did, I put 58 million fighters in a sector and entered it in a ship with 400k figs, and 12,000 shields, possessing 1.8 odds, there were NO quasars in the sector. I was podded by the offensive fighters alone! I entered again and was podded. Yet, here is a posted capture showing another ship entering the same sector and surviving! I don't get it. I am unaware of the odds of offensive fighters being sysop configurable. You would think that offensive fighters would attack the same no matter what server you are on.

I guess I need this explained to me. How is it, my ship doesn't survive 58 million fighter attack, and someone elses can?

As far as the setting on the canons go, I captured after I placed them in the sector. I used exact same settings on my test planet. You can say I'm mistaken, but I'm not. The planets had the exact amount of ore in the test as did the original planets, and the quasars were set the same.

SGO

quote:Originally posted by Brian T

J. Dean,

Even I don't think you did it out of spite.

That's not what you said when you banned me from your server and deleted my characters.

I wish I had time to play this game, but you know, I can't afford to sit there and input all those commands day after day (I rarely used scripts or macros), and then get undermined unfairly.

It's just not worth it to me. I'm getting too old for it (I turn 44 tomorrow).

SGO

quote:Originally posted by Supreme Galactic Overlord

That's not what you said when you banned me from your server and deleted my characters.

It's just not worth it to me. I'm getting too old for it (I turn 44 tomorrow).



Perhaps not but eitherway as I said early sorry if I said anyhting out of line or acted like an Butt. We all have bad days, weeks, months or whatever. Anyway have a great 44th birthday. I turn 42 in April, so I'm not far behind you there. [:)]

Brian

quote:Originally posted by Supreme Galactic Overlord

I saw the captures posted concerning the attack of offensive fighters and I was beside myself. Ok, I guess there is actually something I don't understand about how this game works (mechanics wise). I'm not a mathematician, I only know from personal experience.

Here's what I did, I put 58 million fighters in a sector and entered it in a ship with 400k figs, and 12,000 shields, possessing 1.8 odds, there were NO quasars in the sector. I was podded by the offensive fighters alone! I entered again and was podded. Yet, here is a posted capture showing another ship entering the same sector and surviving! I don't get it. I am unaware of the odds of offensive fighters being sysop configurable. You would think that offensive fighters would attack the same no matter what server you are on.

I guess I need this explained to me. How is it, my ship doesn't survive 58 million fighter attack, and someone elses can?

As far as the setting on the canons go, I captured after I placed them in the sector. I used exact same settings on my test planet. You can say I'm mistaken, but I'm not. The planets had the exact amount of ore in the test as did the original planets, and the quasars were set the same.

SGO



What you showed us was a 1.8 odds ship getting the business end of quasar cannons and being podded before the sector figs could attack.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't MBBS settings affect how damage is done by qcannons and offensive fighters? http://www.tw-cabal.com/formulas.html#M ... eld%20Odds

quote:
* NOTE: As of version .55, Offensive figs will calculate the number of figs required to destroy your ship (your max total shields and figs, not your current shields and figs as in previous versions) based on 1:1 odds, and then send 1.25 times that amount (or the remaining figs if it's less than that). If you are in a ship with 1:1.3 odds or better, your ship will survive the attack. Any figs that survive the attack or aren't used remain in the sector..


If you used a ship with 1.8 odds and no qcannons, you will survive the off sector figs in MBBS mode with TWGS .55 or higher. Provided there were no mines in the sector.

Now a ptorp can cancel out the sector qcannons, mines, and sector figs. I think you said ptorps were disabled in this game? Are you 100% sure about the qcannon levels? You said you captured the levels before the invasion, but we never saw your captures of the planets before they got invaded. Also with duping going on, someone could have drained your sector qcannons to a level that a ship with 400K figs could survive.

quote:Originally posted by Supreme Galactic Overlord

Here's what I did, I put 58 million fighters in a sector and entered it in a ship with 400k figs, and 12,000 shields, possessing 1.8 odds, there were NO quasars in the sector. I was podded by the offensive fighters alone! I entered again and was podded. Yet, here is a posted capture showing another ship entering the same sector and surviving! I don't get it. I am unaware of the odds of offensive fighters being sysop configurable. You would think that offensive fighters would attack the same no matter what server you are on.

I guess I need this explained to me. How is it, my ship doesn't survive 58 million fighter attack, and someone elses can?

As far as the setting on the canons go, I captured after I placed them in the sector. I used exact same settings on my test planet. You can say I'm mistaken, but I'm not. The planets had the exact amount of ore in the test as did the original planets, and the quasars were set the same.

SGO



Were the defensive odds 1.8:1? It's the defensive odds that matter. Even in older versions of twgs, before the change in offensive fig behavior, you would survive that. Of course, this assumes that the ship held 400k figs and 12k shields and that you actually HAD 400k figs and 12k shields on it. If you entered a sector with just offensive fighters under these conditions, you would survive. If you didn't, then one of the above conditions was not met.

MBBS mode affects atmostpheric cannons only, not sector cannons and not offensive fig behavior.

quote:Originally posted by Harley Nuss (teamEIS)

MBBS mode affects atmostpheric cannons only, not sector cannons and not offensive fig behavior.


Thanks for verifying it.

So either his qcannons were not set the same as his test server game, or someone mothed them with dupe accounts before the invasion.

His statement that he had a 1.8 odds ship that was destroyed by off sector figs is flawed logic based on what we know about the game now. MBBS cannot change the behavior of off sector figs. So they behave the same in a MBBS or Non-MBBS game. If the ship has 1.3 or over def odds, it will survive the off sector figs by themselves. If he claimed to have set up a game where a 1.8 def odds ship did not survive the off sector figs, then that is a fallacy. The only capture he did show was showing Baltar and company getting blasted by qcannon blasts, not off sector figs. Therefore we can safely say that it was not the off sector figs that did in the players and anyone in a 1.3 def odds or above ship can survive the off sector figs by themselves.

Qcannon blasts, mines, are a totally different story.