quote: you missed Rave's point completely.... if an unlim game lasts beyond the first 24-48 hours, there is no real competition in the game...



That was her point?? Really did you ask her cuz it clearly says...

quote: As for the player rankings shown above, a corp of three players in a game with 18 or so players, with corps averaging two players each, is no great victory. I see plenty of one and two player corps, and in the first player list at least, only one corp of three players (the winners). Perhaps you should find some more heavily populated unlimited turn games.



Is no great victory Clearly. Her point was to put me in my place clearly. Did you read any of this? I think her point was to say this game had very few players, and so it wasn't impressive. As for competition I guess Res is no competition huh?

quote: Look at some of the best killers in turn limited games today. Specifically Res Judicata and Xide.

Rave thinks he is. As for me not being any good, did I say I was?? Did BC say he was?? If so plez quote us pimp. Why are you turning this into a judge of skills? Plez don't judge peeps you have never even played against it makes you look REAL silly guy.

LokI is powering up weapons systems!

quote:
Well I guess we will see now as Bone collector seems to be the new corp 3 biatch over on coastgames game a

Zandramus



He's our newest mule for now. Once we actually have some figs, we may all get to do more interesting stuff

quote:He's our newest mule for now. Once we actually have some figs, we may all get to do more interesting stuff


I see that he is fedsafe for the moment ... Kemper I assume you will soon let him off his leash ... especially if corp 1 takes a dive here in a few days...

I have a new Hound int he game as well.

Zandramus





Riftwars.dnsalias.com
RiftwarsBBS.mine.nu port 23

quote:
you missed Rave's point completely.... if an unlim game lasts beyond the first 24-48 hours, there is no real competition in the game...


That was definitely one of the points I was trying to make. I wouldn't even give it a 48 hour outside window. In unlimited games I've watched Xide and Gravedigr (and Grazhopper as well) play in, they're usually either completely over in the first three or four hours (tops) or locked down and just a matter of cleaning up the riff-raff within 24 hours.

quote:
does anyone recall Silver Dragon's Tournament of the Unlimiteds? it was over within hours of opening... he had to do a TOU II the next day, and that was over within 24 hours, too........


If I remember correctly, there were three runs of TOU. The first TOU was over in two and a half hours. TOU II was over something like 19 hours, and TOU III was over in under a day as well. Xide and corp won all three hands down, without any serious problems despite some very good competition (competition in numbers and skill).

quote:
it sounds like to me you guys are not only bad turns-players, you are only mediocre unlim players, too....


There aren't many players like Xide out there... remember that Xide basically created the unlimited turn games we see today. The scripts, the strategy, etc... a large majority of todays unlimited turn gameplay originated with Xide and TWX. Very few people can come close to matching the ultra-elites such as Xide, but that doesn't mean those who don't are poor players. I can't say whether Lowkey or the others are good players or bad players (in either unlims or turn limited games) because I haven't seen them play.

Lisa M. Wilson
aka Rave

quote:
That was her point?? Really did you ask her cuz it clearly says...


Well, it was one of the points I was trying to make...

quote:
Is no great victory Clearly. Her point was to put me in my place clearly. Did you read any of this? I think her point was to say this game had very few players, and so it wasn't impressive. As for competition I guess Res is no competition huh?


Oh no, my "putting in place days are over," or so I'd like to hope. My thoughts here was it looked like you had a corp of three, playing against a other teams with a max corp size of two. In an unlimited turn game it doesn't (shouldn't?) take a larger size team to outproduce smaller teams, then take the assets of the smaller team. Just as with most turn-limited games its a war of attrition (you expend military assets in order to gain additional assets), but in unlimited turn games the speed of attrition is accelerated to the nth degree.

As for Res, I usually don't take much notice of Res being #ship destroyed#. Don't get me wrong, he's a skilled HK (hunter/killer) player, but from both personal experience and from secondhand knowledge he's far more likely to be #sd# from a simple CBY than he is from being killed by other players. I see Res #sd# and that's my first impression...

quote:
Rave thinks he is. As for me not being any good, did I say I was?? Did BC say he was?? If so plez quote us pimp. Why are you turning this into a judge of skills? Plez don't judge peeps you have never even played against it makes you look REAL silly guy.


There's really no true comparison of skill between dedicated unlimited players and dedicated turn-limited players (in my honest opinion). Consider for a second a turn-limited player entering an unlimited turn game with no rules against attacking, etc. The player is likely to die fairly quickly (if they're not familiar with the arcade speed of unlims). If an unlimited turn player enters a turn limited game, they'll most likely eventually lose by not being able to manage assets/turns as well as the experienced turn-limited players... they get outproduced and outresourced and eventually become easy targets.

Honestly I used to despise anyone who played unlimited turn games. That's not the case anymore. Thankfully I learned that its just a different type of Trade Wars, and the same respect should be shown for those who play unlimited turns as (I would hope) they would show towards turn-limited players.

My only beef with unlimited turn players these days is that the unlimited turn games draw many, many new players and its actually (IMHO) the worst type of environment for new players to get their feet wet. They usually last all of ten seconds, if that, after getting out into open space, and I hate thinking of even the slightest possibility of a player walking away from Trade Wars because of it. But then, I've seen the same thing happen in turn limiteds, just not as often (again, my opinion).

Lisa M. Wilson
aka Rave

quote:

I see that he is fedsafe for the moment ... Kemper I assume you will soon let him off his leash ... especially if corp 1 takes a dive here in a few days...

I have a new Hound int he game as well.

Zandramus



It's not a matter of "having a leash" on someone or not, different people have different responsibilities. I try to get everyone doing something that they are alright with. At this point, we are outgunned, so most people's responsibilities are producing resources. When we have enough resources to be able to spend them with some success, the focus of our activities will change.

Rave i like you. Maybe if you ever need some newbie to help you play a game you would look me up. I could use all the pointers you were willing to give in turns as i guess i am going to have to really learn them now to kick the crap out of some peeps like zandramus. I am glad that someone understands my points.

As for you zandramus, you better hope that he keeps me on a leash for the next ten years. This is only a game i know, but i like nothing better than the challenge of some self proclaimed good player telling me what he will do to me. Better catch me when i am offline or catch me now while i dont have figs. Cuz if you try to catch me when i do you will be very sorry.

hahaha
Bone, Zand is a pushover you wont have any trouble with him. He's all talk and 100% predictable. Just watch your back for severian when you go to pick on those guys.

Chris Rose
http://www.geocities.com/camaro81rk

quote:
Rave i like you.


Hmm... you have no clue what you're saying!

quote:
Maybe if you ever need some newbie to help you play a game you would look me up. I could use all the pointers you were willing to give in turns as i guess i am going to have to really learn them now to kick the crap out of some peeps like zandramus.


Hold that thought. I'm pretty much retired, aside from one little 15,000 sector, 250 turn game, and that one is basically dead these days. (I just don't want to let go of my last game...) Before I began getting more actively involved in the day-to-day stuff of EIS, I was all gung-ho about getting a group of newer players together to show them the ropes... but that's pretty much been put on the backburner indefinitely.

quote:
I am glad that someone understands my points.


I try... [sigh]

Lisa M. Wilson
aka Rave

Heh, i was looking forward to seeing him around on our game at coastgames, but i see someone #SD# him today. Better luck tomorrow, zandramus.

Bone

ROFL, this is too funny. I just had to make an account to respond.
PHX, you're a somewhat decent player, but when it comes to unlimited games, ya got no skills. I mean shiat, u blind twarp'd twice in one nite in that game I played with u and '?'.

This is all apples and oranges ppl. Unlimited games vs Turns. I see them both as 2 different entities. Each require a very different set of strategies, gameplans, and know how. For one turn based player to call an unlimited guy skilless and a shitty Butt player, is down right ignorant, and vice versa.

These guys u call crappy TW players PHX; like BC, TUROK, Loki, and Em are very good at unlimited games, no matter what they say. They've mastered the unlimited stratgies and use their scripts well. Ya they like to crap talk soemtimes over fed, but who doesnt? You even read your log there anyways PHX, most of it wasnt even aimed at u moron. They crap talkin each other.

Unlimited games aren't all scripts ppl. They may be more used since theres no turn limit, but that just means your counter-measures have to be that much better and u have to think in a different way. I ain't the best unlimited player, but I gaurantee I'd kill at least half of ya if u came to my realm. Goes both ways. I'd get my Butt creamed in a turn based game. You all say that it takes way much more skill, but you're wrong. It takes different skills. Turn based games u can just ptorp someone and they gone for the day. Unlimited, they back in a few minutes. Turn games u dont have to worry about someone invading u very much because u got so few turns and the others do aswell. You hide at nite without much of a worry you're base is gone when u wake up.

I wont crap talk any turn based guys cuz they suck at unlimited, and I'd hope the same respect is returned. For all those that think I'm talkin out my Butt and I'm just so wrong, then your obviously too ignorant and hippocritical to realize the truth.

My 2 cents. Take it or leave it, but definately let it sink in.

quote:
Turn based games u can just ptorp someone and they gone for the day. Unlimited, they back in a few minutes. Turn games u dont have to worry about someone invading u very much because u got so few turns and the others do aswell. You hide at nite without much of a worry you're base is gone when u wake up.


I don't know you, but you obviously don't have experience with competative turn based games. You play against good players and expect your base to be there when you wake up, and you will be sorely mistaken. Also p-torping someone doesn't mean someone can't do anything for a day, it just means they can't do anything turn intensive for a day. I've seen more than a few decent players die to someone they have "safely photoned"

Haha good god I can't believe this topic has gone on so long. Ya know if everyone here played as well as they talk smack perhaps so many players wouldn't be outclassed so easily.

I just wanted to throw in my 2 cents for all it's worth. I'd like to start by saying, naturally, Rave is right as usual in her posts above.

What I don't get is why all the talk regarding whether unlimited games or turn games are better etc... They're completely different in strategy, and usually edits as well. Turn games and unlimiteds are literally like night and day, and I don't think any player from one side can say they are better than one from the other.

All of the talk about scripts is just insane lately too. There's a big difference between scripts and 24/7 defensive bot type scripts... and I really do think that distinction should be made. We all do what we can to play better, to destroy the other guy's ship a few seconds faster or more efficiently than the last time, etc...

Anyone can dominate a turn or unlimited game early on, especially when they have a corp they can rely on. BUT... I think it is hasty to assume that just because one corp can dominate on server A and server B, that they could not be completely outclassed playing on a server with new opponents.

I think my last point will be simply this... Who cares? I mean really, it's trade wars. If you have to take any of it seriously then you need to scrape your arse out of your computer chair and find another hobby, LMAO.

Rules to live by?
You are only as good as the last person you podded.
You are only as elite as your last #SD# or game win.
You are not elite if all you can manage to do is kill the exact same people over and over again, and do not seek out more challenge.
Relax, it is ONLY a game.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Only those who attempt the absurd can acheive the impossible.

Hale (aka Deadly Nightshade)

quote:You are only as elite as your last #SD#

WOW! So does that mean i am as good as res? The only problem i have with your post is the seek out better competition part. If you enjoy unlimiteds, it is tough to seek out better comp. The people that play them consistently is all there is. It is tough to seek out better comp when none of the good players play them. I would give anything to have xide show up in a game i play. Yeah, i would take a teeth kicking, but it would be fun. We seek out the best games. Period. If there is an unlimited that bangs loki and I are usually there so there isnt much more i can do to find better comp.

I personally am tired of the talk about scripts. People can say what they want, but usually the ones whining about scripts are the ones without them. Hell, even you used to whine about scripts but then you got some decent ones and used pretty effectively against us a couple of times. Scripts are the future. I am playing in a turns game right now where one of the corps uses a ptorp script good enough that i would hesitate to hit their figs. For your information posi, they run this script constantly as far as i can tell. So i guess that would qualify as a 24/7 script? Scripts are everywhere now, not just in unlimited.

Finally, i miss you Zandramus. I dont know if i can continue on Coast games now that you are gone. It is gonna be REAL tough to kill me if you stay #SD# all the time. I have been on the game three days and you have been dead all but like four hours. I told you before that you really should consider how good you arent before making ridiculous claims about being able to destroy other people.

BC..

LOL, I will have to catch ya in another game.. we are pretty much done in Coastgames... I left myself in a Defender over a couple of crap planets this morning and posted my location in hopes that corp 1 would waste another million fighters on me, and give you guys an edge on them...

You guys are going to have your hands full with them , But Kemper is an excellent player and I would assume that your corp will triumph. As for us our main objective throughout the first 3 weeks was to track down and kill Bohiemian... that was our challenge and we accomplished that... once that was done we were too far behind in the building sense to catch up with corp 1.

Therefore we are done... we have no level 4 or above planets left, and all of our assets are gone. Corp 1 is making about 150 mill a day just selling stuff off their planets... and you guys I hope will be able to outpace them soon enough...

Good luck and I will catch you in another game soon I hope.

Zandramus


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