quote:Originally posted by Bnix13

Your touchy and playing off and on maybe and casually, nobody knows you from what i get. You aren't taking suggestions your just saying you have a plan you said you'de appreciate feedback. You don't seem to be accepting it very well. And if you want people to play your game when you accompish it you better not be so rude to your potential audience, namely the people giving you feedback are curious about it so why alienate them?


Feedback is one thing bub, outright disrespect and calling me stupid, are quite the other. I accepted and answered the critisism, its them that took it to a personal level. And if people like Slim and Drac are the only players around here im sure i will have no problem finding players elsewere. Its not like i dont have an internet full of non morons like this place has proven to have.

<Posted by Vash>
And if people like Slim and Drac are the only players around here im sure i will have no problem finding players elsewere. Its not like i dont have an internet full of non morons like this place has proven to have.


bye bye now

you basically build a civilization, very very few people who play tradewars are willing to invest in a game spanning 4 years. I challenge you to name 5 reputable players who are interested in this concept, people aren't attacking your character, although some of them are harsh in essense none are meant to be hurtful. Trust me 99% of players in tradewars play to the war part. Destroying others work. Kinda mean but it's true. Not one person on this forum has expressed interest, some mocked you after you started taking it personel, but not before. You are talking to the wrong audience for this appariently the audience is no one who has responded b/c none of them seem to express interest in participating. Far more games you can play that have more of a diplomatic approach for the newbs and a waring approach for people who want to venture beyond. In the next 10 years your audience, what there is that you can't back up (lack of hard data instead of vague remarks) will shrink If you got everyone in that is interested you'll prolly get one game played for about 3 months by each player before they get bored. This is not the place apparently to post your ideas, i suggest you find another place to get players, I don't know where you could find one but this is not it. For anything you took personal I appologize none of the remarks were made to be personell and your taking your idea with a closed minded approach and your presenting your idea in the wrong place. P.S. Funny I don't here anyone else calling people morons we're the mean ones...

Well, I tried it in another post to smooth things over, but seem to want to attack. So I will just list the critical points here for you to look over, and address:

1.) Universe size is limited to 20k. Perhaps in version 4 it may be larger, but I do not believe that is official anywhere. So your plans to make the universe 60k+ will need to be addressed. How do you plan to address this?

2.) Rating system. Currently it is extremely vague, HOW does the rating system work. For players to agree to play under rules, they would need to know them. Are they based on credit resource? Planets, figs? What is the forumla? Does it go 1-10, 1-100, 1 - 1,000,000?
How will it address newer vs experienced players. I fear an elite player with 1/2 the figs of a newer player.

3.) You have addressed that there been research of expressed interest. How many players have expressed interest? People want to play games with numerous people.

4.) Your invasion has suggested that the two people must be within 100k figs of each other. With no photons, how will this account for figs lost to cannon damage. Since cannons do 1/3 the ore used. Assuming a stock Volcanic, that is 333,333 figs per planet. So with 4 planets in a sector, that is roughly 1.3M figs lost to a cannon. So you would now be short those 1.3M figs for the invasion. How will you account for this?

5.) Unlimited turns = Unlimited cash. Well known rule of TW. With unlimited turns, people will have so many figs, without photons, how can you invade after a point. Any player worth anything can defend a base with unlimited resources. TW as it was designed favors the defender.

6.) What will be ship / planet edits. As unlike many other games, TW does not support a mod interface (similar to Doom, UT, etc), it has very limited methods of modifying from base.

7.) What is a "home sector" anywhere I have 4 planets? What limits a player from popping 4 planets in every sector, and putting 1M figs above them. In an unlimited turn game with 4 years of play, you run out of sectors to fill quick.

8.) Invasions. There have been some questions about it, you seem to feel many of the people who gave input are not all that smart in TW. So could you explain your theory for invasions and how it fits in your system

9.) Once the feds have okayed an invasion, how long is it good for? 24 hours? 1 year? 1 month?

I hope this returns the topic back to where it belongs.

Jhereg

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Speed Demon

Say what??

I think you would be better off playing eve then trying to bang and run a game like the one you are describing.

http://www.eve-online.com/

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Except i want to play tradewars, not eve. This is a mod just like adding planet mods, ship mods or stardock mods.. Its just a big bigger level. Trust me, iu know what im doing

lol

I said “Say What??” Because you posted 5 times in a row.

I wish you luck with your game I really do but I think you have chased away anyone who would have even tried it because of your demanding and controlling attitude.
Are you sure I haven’t met you before have you ever used the name Supreme Galactic Overlord or SGO in any of these games you have played. You kinda remind me of him.

May I suggest finding another hobby to supplement some of the time you think about tradwars it might help you to be not so much off a turn off to the other players who post to these forums.
Take me for instance I like to brew my own beer, work on my car, see movies, and spend time with my girl friend. It helps if you don’t think tradewars all the time trust me.

#SD#

I would like to make a several comments on this thread.

1) Any sysop is open to run any sort of game he wants. Others are welcome to leave feedback, but please remember to keep it polite. Ultimately, if you don't like the game, don't play it. Just because someone doesn't share your opinions on what makes a good game doesn't mean either of you are wrong, just that you enjoy different things. Keep that in mind before you begin to argue too fiercely about the feasibility of a game.

2) Any sort of mocking or derisive post is not welcome in this forum. It is a sysop/gameop forum designed for sysops/gameops to discuss server/game ideas and issues. If your post is not polite, it is not welcome here.

3) While a sysop is free to any game he sees fit, he is not exempt from the rules of these forums. When someone gives feedback that you do not agree with, you are not allowed to attempt to belittle the person giving that feedback. Once again, if your post is not polite, it is not welcome here.

4) The game as it stands currently will only support a 20k sector games. There is no anticipated release date for any version that will allow more than that. Any games that rely on more than 20k sectors will have to remain nothing more than an idea until/unless a version of TWGS is released that will allow it.

5) I am going to allow this thread to continue as is. However, I want to make it perfectly clear that I will not allow any more posts that even push the line of acceptable. Any future posts that I feel are out of line will be deleted and it is possible the poster will face a suspension.

6) Finally, I would like to remind vash that if he didn't want feedback on his game idea, he shouldn't have asked for it. However, before becoming discouraged over his idea, remember that there are plenty of people who read the forums but don't want to get involved in posting. The best way to find out the true interest in your game is to continue with development, perhaps considering the issues that have been raised here, then when the time comes, put the game online and see how much interest there is in it. That will be the best judge of whether or not the game is a success

quote:Originally posted by Harley Nuss (teamEIS)

I would like to make a several comments on this thread.

1) Any sysop is open to run any sort of game he wants. Others are welcome to leave feedback, but please remember to keep it polite. Ultimately, if you don't like the game, don't play it. Just because someone doesn't share your opinions on what makes a good game doesn't mean either of you are wrong, just that you enjoy different things. Keep that in mind before you begin to argue too fiercely about the feasibility of a game.

2) Any sort of mocking or derisive post is not welcome in this forum. It is a sysop/gameop forum designed for sysops/gameops to discuss server/game ideas and issues. If your post is not polite, it is not welcome here.

3) While a sysop is free to any game he sees fit, he is not exempt from the rules of these forums. When someone gives feedback that you do not agree with, you are not allowed to attempt to belittle the person giving that feedback. Once again, if your post is not polite, it is not welcome here.

4) The game as it stands currently will only support a 20k sector games. There is no anticipated release date for any version that will allow more than that. Any games that rely on more than 20k sectors will have to remain nothing more than an idea until/unless a version of TWGS is released that will allow it.

5) I am going to allow this thread to continue as is. However, I want to make it perfectly clear that I will not allow any more posts that even push the line of acceptable. Any future posts that I feel are out of line will be deleted and it is possible the poster will face a suspension.

6) Finally, I would like to remind vash that if he didn't want feedback on his game idea, he shouldn't have asked for it. However, before becoming discouraged over his idea, remember that there are plenty of people who read the forums but don't want to get involved in posting. The best way to find out the true interest in your game is to continue with development, perhaps considering the issues that have been raised here, then when the time comes, put the game online and see how much interest there is in it. That will be the best judge of whether or not the game is a success


This is what i wanted, a fair critisism and feedback, thank you Harley for your FEEDBACk seems some people here think feedback is telling the other person they are dumb for even atempting what they wish to do. I am in no way rude but i have taken much offense from Slim Shady's comments (Maybe he's inspired by the real slim shady moron) I will leave this board as it seems the eisteam is the only ones that take me seriously. Bye bye players, and thanks again Harley

sigh...
you give an idea, ask for feedback.
so we tell you why your idea will not work and even try to give you some help understanding why it doesnt work.
you throw a fit and get pissy, which in turn lowers everyone else's threshhold of trying to stay nice.
honestly.
try this.
ask Harley about your idea on icq. if you can manage to stay polite and LISTEN to him, you will realize your mistakes. if you get pissy with him for telling you facts, well, then he will probably tell you off the same as everyone else.
he's nice because it's his responsibility to be nice here. you'll notice he said nothing about your ranking system or your invasion concepts, yet he knows more about this game than anyone else i know. i wonder why that is? probably because he know's we were right, but wanted the forum to cool down so he doesnt have to ban anyone. sometimes if a dog is barking loud you dont just put it outside as it will continue to bark, sometimes louder. sometimes you have to just scratch it behind the ear to make it shut up.


Slim Shady

Hey I will bite on this one,
Although I may be new to running a TWGS I am first and formoat a TW player, and have been for many years, I am 42 years old and as I have said I have played it for many years. I think Vash's ideas have some merit, but I don't think they are feasible at this time, I agree with a lot of what Slim and Draconis have to say.

I have had personal conversations via E-mail with John Pritchett about some of the problems that I have had with putting my gameserver on the new windows 2003 server O/S and he helped me out a lot and have answered many of my questions and there was no hint of a 40 K sector game or more, but that doesn't mean it couldn't happen.

I am in college going for a Bachelors degree in programming and network development, and have access to the SDK's to write programs and even I am tempted to look under the hood of TWGS to see if I can improve upon it, but I haven't because I like how it is now, if there are going to be any additional sectors on the server then I feel it is up to the creators to do this.

As for anyone being better than the other, well I have a soloution to this, I can have a copy of the hardest game I have loaded on my server and use it as the template for a special game for all to really show their stuff and what they are made of, but honestly my money would be on Slim or Draconis.

I post this not to be a protagonist or anything, but to offer a productive and a peaceful (so to speak, in TW) way to resolve who really knows their stuff. The game I have is really setup with a few really hard ships to win from aliens and to capture the paradise planets I have in it, which is a chore in itself, with over 2 bil figs each protecting them, I really would like to see who is the best. That is really what I originally set up the site for. Right now I have some players in the game trying to geear up enough to take those planets and the Unique Aliens' ships.

All are invited to play in the game or the other game which is similar but starts you off with dirt, your choice. From where I sit I can see both sides of the conflict that was going on and give credits for merits both ways, but in heart I have to agree with Slim and Draconis.

Vulcan
Vulcan's Forge at; http://vulcansforge-online.net

telnet://vulcansforge-online.net

quote:Originally posted by Slim Shady

also 4 years? who wants to play a text based game for 4 years where they can't actually win?
Slim


Actually, there are lots of people out there who are playing "old" games. There is a BBS in Ontario, "Doctor on Board", that has one game that has been running for almost 5 years! The longest-running corp in this game has something like 300 planets, many of them with max credits in the treasury (999 trillion). Having unlimited cash means no one has to bother with trading, and any new players coming in are given a "grubstake" of a billion or two to get started with. Since all of the existing players have enough sector defences to fight off any conceivable invasion, no one attacks anyone else; the focus of this game is to reclaim the hundreds of Rogue planets that have been left behind by players who have dropped out. It's not for everyone, but I can tell you that it's kind of fun to play this game with unlimited cash, unlimited figs, and no worries about other players attacking you. There are usually 20 players running, and they stay for a a few weeks or months, then turn their Corps over to someone else when they have had enough. I applaud Vash for comsidering hosting a long-term game; there aren't enough of them around.

I'll reply in the "smack talk" Forum, lest I be banned

quote:Originally posted by lcharlot

quote:Originally posted by Slim Shady

also 4 years? who wants to play a text based game for 4 years where they can't actually win?
Slim


Actually, there are lots of people out there who are playing "old" games. There is a BBS in Ontario, "Doctor on Board", that has one game that has been running for almost 5 years! The longest-running corp in this game has something like 300 planets, many of them with max credits in the treasury (999 trillion). Having unlimited cash means no one has to bother with trading, and any new players coming in are given a "grubstake" of a billion or two to get started with. Since all of the existing players have enough sector defences to fight off any conceivable invasion, no one attacks anyone else; the focus of this game is to reclaim the hundreds of Rogue planets that have been left behind by players who have dropped out. It's not for everyone, but I can tell you that it's kind of fun to play this game with unlimited cash, unlimited figs, and no worries about other players attacking you. There are usually 20 players running, and they stay for a a few weeks or months, then turn their Corps over to someone else when they have had enough. I applaud Vash for comsidering hosting a long-term game; there aren't enough of them around.

Depends on what you mean by lots of people really, i think of it more as a % than a number, and you said so yourself, many people come in "There are usually 20 players running, and they stay for a a few weeks or months" Meaning 20 players on actually playing the game, not actively playing persay. And it's an interesting concept but i think most people would fit into the few weeks category rather than the months, and more the months than that of years. There is a player base but not for a player base many of us think of. It's one of alternating players not of a constant group playing for 4 years or more, Once you get to the point you have 300 maxed planets, 999 trillion creds in cits you get bored i believe. Many people enjoy the "trade" part of tradewars but many people get bored when there isn't "wars" involved invovled in the game, many of the people move on b/c they relized they are only playing half the game. Just my 2 cents on this ongoing subject that many of us hoped was dead. But now that i think of it there was some merit to the game. It was the technical issues involved that got many people upset, not the concept. It got heated after the issues arrised and the only rebutle we received was in essence "your stupid" funny how most of the hot topics are arguments instead of actual information.

lets play trade wars guys only here is the thing, we are not going to TRADE, and we are not going to have any WARS.. ya i know, its GENIOUS!
sigh...

Slim

I wouldn't say its genious and in class today i said 49er's didn't start with an F it started with a 4. Yes slim i know your kidding... Just had to say that somewhere... Funniest thing i've said in a long time though and i had to put it somewhere, Thanks for the opportunity slim.

Hey, I got an idea. Why don't we help him understand the ways of the Punyverse? Why does everyone always want to smash and bash the new guy? he has a new idea. Instead of bashing him and telling him this is the way it is and if you don't do it the way we say is right, you will fail and we're gonna call you names, why don't we take the posture of "hey, we know a lot about this game, maybe we can help him make his idea work."

The one thing the Martin's wrote into this game from the very beginning was limitless possibilities. Possibilities a lot of you new scriptmeisters have never even thought of or failed to realize even when they were staring you in the face.

I have played in games that lasted 6 months or more. They are not unheard of. Who's to say you can't create a real time civilization in this game that can last for years? If you say it's not possible, then you are easily defeated by someone that thinks they can.

What is the underlying factor of this game? What makes it work? ... It's math. If you can find a mathematical equation that fits your needs in this game, you can apply it any way you wish. Including games that last an eternity.

What about editing in a completed, uncapturable Federal stronghold on one side of the Punyverse to be the "government" that operates just like our government. They would be in charge of enforcing the laws of the Punyverse. Make it 200 to 500 sectors of wall to wall maxxed L6 planets. Virtually impenetrable. Players could come in and elect to be good "and join the Federalies force" or common folk who can rob and steal on the sly. or just flat out Evil always on the run from the cops. If they get caught, they get punished by the Feds according to the laws voted on by all those that are part of the Punyverse....

I think there are ways to do it. You just have to get creative. Here's an answer for the obvious question. if someone plays for a long time, they could possibly amass holdings that exceeed the Federals. You could set a tax base. Use some of their holdings as citizens of the Punyverse to further enhance the Federals holdings keeping them the strongest. the stronger the citizens get, the stronger the federals get... just like in real life.