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Crunchers Bug Thread
https://mail.black-squirrel.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=33980		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Helix [ Sun May 19, 2013 6:42 am ]
Post subject:  Crunchers Bug Thread
Bug use (mega rob, alien planet farming, fig desyncs in v1)
Author:  Cruncher [ Sun May 19, 2013 7:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
For those of us who are unfamiliar, what is the fig desync bug?

How do you work it, what are it's advantages?

If this is being allowed, then the details need to be disclosed.
Author:  T0yman [ Sun May 19, 2013 8:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
Well first using the word "ethics" and "Trade Wars" in the same sentence is some what crazy. We ... Yes "WE" have all been guilty at some point in bending the rules to fit the need at the moment. If you show me a person that is not guilty I will show someone that is just not trying to win. Sorry but this game like anything competitive drives people to bend rules and look for any loophole imaginable. It would be nice if there was a way to implement rules and let the game enforce them, but that is just not the case at this point and time, and probably never will be in the current state without a complete rewrite.
Author:  Kavanagh [ Sun May 19, 2013 10:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
I agree with you. It is supposed to be a WAR.

Despite all I have posted over the years about my opposition to certain tactics, mainly reactive attack scripts, I have always been of the opinion that ANYTHING that the in-built game rules allow should be permitted. Sysop/Gameop rules can be easily circumvented undetectably by a good script writer. That puts other players at a disadvantage.

No Megacorping/asset transfer? Several undetectable ways around that.

Dis-enable CIM? Not sure if thats a TWGS option, was possible HVS, took me 15 minutes to figure a way to ZTM without CIM, not much longer to script it.

No information sharing. That is absurd. ICQ, email? Smoke signals?

Etc., etc.

That said, I dislike players using reactive attack scripts in all but tournies, they really do diminish the player base by keeping newbies and retreads from ever returning.
Author:  Helix [ Sun May 19, 2013 1:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Crunchers bug thread
Cruncher wrote:
For those of us who are unfamiliar, what is the fig desync bug?

How do you work it, what are it's advantages?

If this is being allowed, then the details need to be disclosed.


Sure, so do a forum search. A simple and effective means of solving your problem
Author:  Cruncher [ Sun May 19, 2013 2:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
Helix wrote:
Cruncher wrote:
For those of us who are unfamiliar, what is the fig desync bug?

How do you work it, what are it's advantages?

If this is being allowed, then the details need to be disclosed.


Sure, so do a forum search. A simple and effective means of solving your problem without derailing the thread.


How can this be a derail? You brought up the topic, or are you just in the mood to argue / heated debate over truce games?
Author:  Helix [ Sun May 19, 2013 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Crunchers bug thread
Cruncher wrote:
Helix wrote:
Cruncher wrote:
For those of us who are unfamiliar, what is the fig desync bug?

How do you work it, what are it's advantages?

If this is being allowed, then the details need to be disclosed.


Sure, so do a forum search. A simple and effective means of solving your problem without derailing the thread.


How can this be a derail? You brought up the topic, or are you just in the mood to argue / heated debate over truce games?

Okay Big D, now you have thread about bugs
Author:  Cruncher [ Sun May 19, 2013 2:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
Helix wrote:
Cruncher wrote:
Helix wrote:
Cruncher wrote:
For those of us who are unfamiliar, what is the fig desync bug?

How do you work it, what are it's advantages?

If this is being allowed, then the details need to be disclosed.


Sure, so do a forum search. A simple and effective means of solving your problem without derailing the thread.


How can this be a derail? You brought up the topic, or are you just in the mood to argue / heated debate over truce games?

Okay Big D, make another thread about bugs, please don't hijack this one.



I followed your suggestion and did a search on "fig desync" and just "desync" and this tread was the only match. Is this bug known as different name?

I'm just asking, you brought it up.
Author:  T0yman [ Sun May 19, 2013 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
T0yman wrote:
Well first using the word "ethics" and "Trade Wars" in the same sentence is some what crazy.

Helix wrote:
I don't see a gray area here. You either play by the rules or you do not.

What I am saying it is possible, but when the back is against the wall a player will bend or break a rule to get the upper hand. Since there are almost no mechanics of the game that track it then it is based on ethics and honor, and both of those are seriously lacking in this game.

Helix wrote:
Winning doesn't require breaking an ethical or moral code.

Yet we are all guilty of it at one time or another.

Helix wrote:
What I am trying to say is that one can be good trader, win games, play TradeWars and not break the rules.

I would agree, but once you feel the other player may have taken liberty with a rule it doesn't take long for everyone else to join in.
I could name specifics but let's just leave it that everyone playing this game has done it, no need to drag up the past. ;)
Author:  mob [ Sun May 19, 2013 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
Firstly, T0y is correct. We have all done it, even if it was against the rules truce or not.

Whew....now that I got that off my back...

Ethics is a grey area, because everyone's personal ethics are different. Some people think its ok as long as they don't get caught. Does it make it right, no. Are people still going to do things others might seem unethical, yes.

The one thing about this game is even though a player or corp might abuse a "bug" or tactic, it doesn't mean they will win the game. I have seen a "unmentioned corp" break truce rules by sitting on a planet before it even reaches cit, wait for us to upgrade it, then claimed it later....and since it didn't show in logs....it was fair game.

Where does this sit with you? BTW....they still got their butts handed to them, no matter if they were just there to start trouble. The one thing that makes an elite player is how you deal with these situations.
Author:  Cruncher [ Sun May 19, 2013 5:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I got into a heated discussion
mob wrote:
Firstly, T0y is correct. We have all done it, even if it was against the rules truce or not.

Whew....now that I got that off my back...

Ethics is a grey area, because everyone's personal ethics are different. Some people think its ok as long as they don't get caught. Does it make it right, no. Are people still going to do things others might seem unethical, yes.

The one thing about this game is even though a player or corp might abuse a "bug" or tactic, it doesn't mean they will win the game. I have seen a "unmentioned corp" break truce rules by sitting on a planet before it even reaches cit, wait for us to upgrade it, then claimed it later....and since it didn't show in logs....it was fair game.

Where does this sit with you? BTW....they still got their butts handed to them, no matter if they were just there to start trouble. The one thing that makes an elite player is how you deal with these situations.


This is exactly why I use certain settings in v2. I don't believe in truce games for the reasons you and Toy mentioned.

The "gray area" comes when there is a "well known bug", well known to some but not to all.
Author:  Mongoose [ Sun May 19, 2013 11:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Crunchers Bug Thread
"Fig desync" sounds like that bug where you could prevent your opponent from taking any action for several seconds by spamming a large number of single fighter attacks in a single burst to the server. I don't remember what version it was in, or if it was ever fixed.
Author:  Kewlbreeze [ Sun May 19, 2013 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Crunchers Bug Thread
Maybe he means fig lock decay? but then again there are so many fig bugs in V2 who knows...
Author:  Helix [ Mon May 20, 2013 1:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Crunchers Bug Thread
Mongoose wrote:
"Fig desync" sounds like that bug where you could prevent your opponent from taking any action for several seconds by spamming a large number of single fighter attacks in a single burst to the server. I don't remember what version it was in, or if it was ever fixed.

Its a v1 bug where 2 or more people lay down a fig in the same sector and one or both or all get kicked to the game menu. It is predominately seen in unlimited when multiple people are running gridding scripts/cashing scripts during a truce. It is also seen regularly when automated grid scripts regrid sectors during a truce.

This bug was fixed in v2 by forcing the first sector action to sync before allowing a second action to occur.
Author:  Kewlbreeze [ Mon May 20, 2013 1:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Crunchers Bug Thread
Helix wrote:
Mongoose wrote:
"Fig desync" sounds like that bug where you could prevent your opponent from taking any action for several seconds by spamming a large number of single fighter attacks in a single burst to the server. I don't remember what version it was in, or if it was ever fixed.

Its a v1 bug where 2 or more people lay down a fig in the same sector and one or both or all get kicked to the game menu. It is predominately seen in unlimited when multiple people are running gridding scripts/cashing scripts during a truce. It is also seen regularly when automated grid scripts regrid sectors during a truce.

This bug was fixed in v2 by forcing the first sector action to sync before allowing a second action to occur.


OH ok I know what your talking about.. that's where the tag script comes into play... oh btw it's not fixed in v2 I dough it ever will be. and that attempt of a fix made another bug too... good thing I rarely play unlims..
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