I simply believe that if the community wishes the awards done a certain way then they should do it that way and put there energies toward something positive instead of complaining about how someone (namely Vulcan whose energies are elsewhere with family issues) set it up to be done. It is my understanding that he wanted the full support and input from the community on the awards after last years less than stellar show. However a RL thing got in the way and he pulled others in at the 11th hour to get it done. Perhaps we can show some compassion and let any complaining go till next year when a larger segment of the community can be involved. If I had known the full extent of things I would have volunteered as I am sure many many other including yourself would have also. As it goes a couple of well meaning peeps got it done in a short period of time and I thank them for their efforts. I don't think any Smack is necessary or warranted do to the circumstances.
Thats my 2 cents on that and in no way is it meant to be inflammatory.

I understand where you are coming from. I don't like conflict and I think that negative posts are most often harmful. Believe me when I say that I am restraining myself. I do not believe that anyone who posted on the subject here meant to start any trouble.

The reason I didn't bring it up is that I never saw the discussion. Just how many days did the community have to respond? Where was the topic that asked for thoughts and ideas? <oh, Parrothead explains in the next post that there wasn't time for discussion due to vulcan's personal issues. Given that, how could we have discussed it??>

I would have responded timely if I had time.   

I saw nothing that asked for imput. I saw only a list of what the categories were going to be and then a changed list. Bravo for those who helped get it changed.

That was all the discussion there was. Nobody wanted a weighed down discussion that prolonged the wait for the nominations to begin.

Another lesson for next year: start the Darn things before Christmas

Ya know... there is a big fat easy solution to all of this.

Want to hear it?

STOP TRYING TO DO IT ALL YOURSELF.

A unilaterial approach will always be the wrong one.

So want a win-win situation? Let people decide on these things instead of deciding for them. That way you don't have to extert all of that energy doing it, and you don't have to extert all of this energy dealing with the aftermath... since the bulk of people that made the solution will usually rise to it's defense. That leaves you to do better things like... oh, making sure there's no smack in the scripts forum.

This can be so easy it's scarey. Heck, if there had been just a little discussion on the categories (as opposed to none) and what they meant prior to them being announced... some of these things would've come to light before they had been stuck in cement.

And phead, in all earnest, trying to pull the "if you make noise you're hurting vulcan! please, won't someone think of vulcan!" card is lame to an extreme degree. That's a form of smack talk and not conducive to an open discussion on the issues. It's not asking for and inviting new opinions, it's trying to shut down the opinions you disagree with.

Remember everytime you do that, God kills a kitten. Please, won't someone think of the kittens! For heaven's sakes... won't someone PLEASE think of the kittens!

Thanks all, if all goes well I will have a official TW Awards site up and going for the next one, also there was a typo on the Awards, this year is actually the 10th annual Awards, ender and I hosted the 9th annual.

9th Annual TW Awards

When you take care of an extremely ill family member for years as I have maybe your opinion on the matter might have some weight with me. "Open Discussion" on issues doesnt involve personal attacks. I dont believe there was a court order preventing any one individual or group from starting the awards process eariler this year. So if anyone wishes to be critical of those who did do it. As far as I am conserned there complaints are falling on deaf ears. Discussion as to "Next Years" Awards would be a positive discussion so by all means carry on with that.Kudos.

Flame and finger pointing is not an "opinion".
People can flame away like infants all they want. I wont condone it and thats "My Opinion" that your trying to shut down isnt't it.
But perhaps this conversation is getting off the point so I will not comment further. Hopefull the Awards discussion starts in a timely manner next year so that Everyone can put in there input.

I agree with you Sing, thats why this whole discussion should be started in November this year, for next year: To allow for the time to work out as many of the bugs as possible.

You're right, there has never really been a Community attempt to set up these awards. Just a couple people trying to do all the work, and always starting it off too late into the new year.

Oh, and Darn the kittens: Tearing up everything she possibly can, knocking change off my dresser while I sleep, jumping up on the counters and knocking **** off of there to play with, and tearing off into the hallway anytime the front door is opened.

I thank Parrot for defending me and my situation, Sing and the others know it as well, and I have tried to get others involved in it earlier, but no one wanted to step up and help. I also wanted to start the Awards earlier as well, but as Parrot said R/L got in the way, and I had a busy time since.

I know it would be easier if others would have stepped up to help, I offered to do it cause I had some experience on it from last years, and set things up in the forums the way I did so as to control the complaints from nomination stuffing, I plan on having a website setup for just TW Awards, and hopefully if others can help in the design, we can get it going and operational soon, this would be a good project for those who are interested, I plan on having the sight to be automated, and do all the figuring of totals and posting the tops of the catagories for voting, and tallying the votes and posting the winners, I know it is a big undertaking, and asking now for the help on getting it under way, any volunteers to help make the site a reality, will be appreciated, also I want to tie the site to the community, and may have it to post to a specific set of threads on the forums, on the progress of the standings from the noms and votes. Of course most of this is just ideas for now.

Also on a side note, I changed the Awards to the 10th Annual Awards, that is what it was supposed to be. ender and I hosted the 9th Annual Awards.

9th Annual TW Awards

Sigh... phead, since you assume you're always right all the time I guess nobody needs to discuss anything further, right? I mean after all... listening to opinions hurts vulcan, right?

*shakes head*

Am I the only one here that sees how completely absurd this is getting? Keep playing "ignore everyone, we're going to do it our way" until you burn out from a dose of stress, bad karma and serious nasty mojo.

In the process why bother asking people ahead of time? I mean sure it would greatly reduce the negatives and make life easier for everyone, but why bother?

Silence, yes, we should start this early this year.

And I really don't see why we can't just use the same categories from last year. They worked fine then.

There are several public domain "election" or "voting" scripts out there. From a database PoV, it's a really simple application... like 3 tables, the category information, the user information and the nominees linked via key to the category table.

It is too late to change the nominations for this year IMO.  I think any hall of fame nominees should be limiited to individuals that have been involved in tradewars for a number of years though.  There needs to be a set rule on how many years.  For instance Eleq is retired and was involved in tradewars for a number of years.  A lot of the nominees this year don't even remember him.  How can a server or individual that has been involved in tw for a few months or even a couple of years be nominated for the hall of fame awards?  I'm not downgrading anyone or any server, but I do think this catagory of awards can be diluted and may be if things rules don't apply.  One solution is may have a group of peoople that can induct an individual or place into the Hall of Fame nominations.  That way the voters have to choose from a list.
 

I agree with Sing here.  I'm not pointing fingers, but the catagories were posted without any discussioin at all from what I seen.  It took 20 posts in a thread to get the "Worst" catagories removed.   Even if it was later in the year before we got to the nominations, the catagories should have been posted in advance for discussion.   We learn from our errors, so this is a lesson for everyone.  I just hope it doesn't slip our minds by next year, because it sucks to make the same mistake twice.
 

------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------Posted: 06-July-2006 at 12:35pm | IP Logged    
Please note.....This is the General Discussion section, not SMACK! Can we stick to topic, please? Just as this is the official EIS forum, I think the TW Awards should be the official TW Awards. I know that Gypsy ran them from this site a few years back. Maybe JP has reasons for not doing them 'officially'. If he does, I'd be curious about his reasons. I know the Awards are flawed. I know that many consider them a popularity contest. I have seen problems with them almost every year, but I have continued to vote in them because they are tradition. I would like for them to regain the respect they deserve. I am suggesting the following: 1) that the moderators of this forum and JP decide who is to run the TW Awards 2) that the person or persons running the awards not be eligible for any of the awards 3) that each award have a description and that it be posted well before the nominations and available year round 4) that the rules not be changed in the middle of the election 5) that voters in the election must have had an account at eis in advance of the election I am also offering to help in any way I can.... even if that is straining my eyes over a list or whatever. maggie
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The topic which I started is TW Awards. It's an easy search.

Since I have a lot of respect for vulcan I will accept that he either forgot that I offered or chose not ask me and not be offended by either.

On the other hand, some moderators/administrators are quick to defend and accuse without having full knowledge of a subject. It is a hard stretch to have respect for them. Is it any wonder that my patience is wearing thin?

Thanks, Maggie, I forgot about you offering, but the others I contacted never got back to me on it, and there were a couple more that offered to help. forgot who at the moment, I hope we can get this together and going proper for the next Awards, and I will make a site for it if need be, or work with who wants to make it, don't matter to me, all I want is others to get involved so it will be a community thing, and if the current community don't want to help then I vote we vote on a committee to make it happen properly, and lets make it work, if it does, then we have something the community can use to come together again.

Sing, I like what you are saying, and if we can get together soon and talk, we will start working on a site for the Awards, if anyone else wants in on it let me know, I am asking now, and asked Sing just now, now are there any other takers? I know Maggie is in, she offered to me a while ago,it slipped my mind cause of issues with my dad, but when I saw her last post here, it hit me like a ton of bricks. And still want you to help Maggie.

Thanks all for the input on the Awards, it does serve to help make it better, just got off to a bad Start.

Thanks all,
Vulcan

um wait I think someone did in november of 06? oh wait they did, but everyone ignored him or said no awards... hmm Now the awards are a dictatorship by the EIS ADMINS... Hmmm WHAT A BUNCH OF CRAP.....

Hmm who did you contact? Who did u ask? hmmm I call BULL****!,

Oh and I decided to comeback to EIS to troll the forums to point out ALL misdeads by ADMINS and MODS..... Regardless if I like you or not.