Well, I don't think it's just talking.. while having a plock, you need to send something to the server, or your connection will time out.

lol. do you people think that twgs just magically doesn't receive characters because it chooses not to respond to them or echo them back? u can send whatever the hell you want at any given time. the twgs will either acknowledge them as a valid command at that point or not, but either way, the twgs will still mark it as your last activity - thus keeping you from timing out.

Fair enough... Guess I'll stay outa this one, since I use more scripts than I do macros... There will be plenty of .56 servers soon enough.. I'll stick with .55 and wait to see what .57 is like..

I take issue with you here K3.

The changes make no difference to my style of play, I seldom use macros except for evasion or mickey mouse xpair before reds start cashing. I use scripts and hand for everything, no personal axe to grind with v56.

I played once only with Res J. He does depend on macro usage and availability of globals for his tactics. Moreover, he directs and supports his Corp very well in that way.

The "bug" issue:
No idea what the bugs are that globals permit - heard of fed phot, dunno how it works, dont wanna know. Eliminating globals does not "fix" it but I cant fault JP for taking the easy way out, I'd do the same. Only losers use bugs. Publish the details and symptoms. 99% of users will just quit a game when we suspect/see usage of same.

The "classical" (or words to that effect) TW game that JP referred to on this or another thread, in reference to script usage not being "traditional" in TW games? that is simply untrue. John (whom I sincerely thank for all that he has done for the game), self admittedly is not a player. I have (now useless) arced libraries of telix for dos tw scripts dating to 1992. My Son used write qmodem scripts for tw antedating that, why I have no idea, 250 turns, 1k sectors, one player online - he's a geek.







quote:Originally posted by Harley Nuss (teamEIS)

quote:Originally posted by Res Judicata

Outlaw, I dont think you know much about TW, or you are 100% script user or whatever, but to REMOVE the ability to USE COMMS and HOLD WARP LOCKS is just too big a change to get over.

I wont ever play a game on ver 56.
You are most welcome to do so without me....




You're blowing this entirely out of proportion. The ability to hold a lock and talk on comms at the same time is far from necessary. You're throwing a hissy fit over nothing. JP will do whatever he thinks is best for the game, and shock of shocks, whether or not res can talk while he has a p-lock doesn't really come into the discussion when bugs are being fixed. I can almost guarantee that comms will not be added back to the p-lock menu. Not because it spites you, but because that's one of the places the globals are buggy.

I have reason to believe that Res is familiar with the fact that a non responsive reply to a prompt will be acknowledged as "activity" by twgs.

quote:Originally posted by Didaskalos

lol. do you people think that twgs just magically doesn't receive characters because it chooses not to respond to them or echo them back? u can send whatever the hell you want at any given time. the twgs will either acknowledge them as a valid command at that point or not, but either way, the twgs will still mark it as your last activity - thus keeping you from timing out.

quote:Originally posted by Kavanagh

I take issue with you here K3.

The changes make no difference to my style of play, I seldom use macros except for evasion or mickey mouse xpair before reds start cashing. I use scripts and hand for everything, no personal axe to grind with v56.

I played once only with Res J. He does depend on macro usage and availability of globals for his tactics. Moreover, he directs and supports his Corp very well in that way.

The "bug" issue:
No idea what the bugs are that globals permit - heard of fed phot, dunno how it works, dont wanna know. Eliminating globals does not "fix" it but I cant fault JP for taking the easy way out, I'd do the same. Only losers use bugs. Publish the details and symptoms. 99% of users will just quit a game when we suspect/see usage of same.

The "classical" (or words to that effect) TW game that JP referred to on this or another thread, in reference to script usage not being "traditional" in TW games? that is simply untrue. John (whom I sincerely thank for all that he has done for the game), self admittedly is not a player. I have (now useless) arced libraries of telix for dos tw scripts dating to 1992. My Son used write qmodem scripts for tw antedating that, why I have no idea, 250 turns, 1k sectors, one player online - he's a geek.



The globals bugs allow a huge range of activity which can cause serious problems in a game. The way the game was designed, there wasn't really any other pratical way to deal with these bugs. The choice JP was left with was to leave the bugs in favor of the convience of some players, or to stop the bugs and make it slightly less convienent for them. He is working on increasing the number of prompts that the comms can be used, but there are a LOT of different prompts in the game, so it takes a bit to get a good list of what is needed. I can say with relative confidence that comms will not be added back to y/n prompts. This is one of the places that globals can be abused at.

As to the goals JP has for where he wants the game to go, that is something you will need to discuss with him. For that most part, I don't think there is anything you can do to eliminate scripting. There are some things that can be done to limit the effectiveness of certain types of scripts, but those changes need to be closely looked at before they are done, as JP is doing.

NOT only Speaking on a y/n WARP LOCK but Protecting the LOCK from possible mis strokes on the keyboard.
Like holding a LOCK IN WTC for 11 hours, and having 3 layers of GLOBALS to LOCK my LOCK was nice to do, talking was only a plus. But the fact remains I love to HOLD PLOCKS, Hell I wrote a rap over it, and protecting the LOCK by keying up FED,HAIL, then SUB prompts/globals allowed me to talk on SUB, and not hit enter twice or once even, and LOSE My Warp Lock.

BUG USERS SUCK Butt as Much as DUPERS.

This latest photon bug gets me, but I guess there are tons of PRIVATELY KNOWN BUGS
that are never reported openly.

I dont know of any other BUGS that RUIN the game currently other then the PHOTON BUG.

Correct me if I am wrong, but just fixing that bug would have been ENOUGH of a FIX for TWGS.

I have no clue really whats up with JP or TWGS, but I wish it was more publicly known, I hear JP dont even play TW, this scares me, as to who some of his advisors are, MOSTLY SCRIPTERS and PROGRAMMERS, where does that leave the common player?

Players that dont script are being forced out, or forced to purchase scripts...

What is really going with TradeWars Game Server?


Res Judicata

quote:Originally posted by Res Judicata
I dont know of any other BUGS that RUIN the game currently other then the PHOTON BUG.

Correct me if I am wrong, but just fixing that bug would have been ENOUGH of a FIX for TWGS.


You're wrong. The globals fix resolves some rather bad holes. There are still other problems that need to be addressed in future revisions. Don't make the mistake of assuming that just because you don't know about something, it doesn't exist.

Ya I am always wrong...
Some FIX, more like a WORK AROUND, or filling 'bad holes' even....

God dam cliques ruin every thing....
Any marketing or Promotional ideas?

Can we raise MONEY to Develop TWGS?
Or we going to monkey foot around...

What can we do to inspire a better product?

Any one do PR work for TEAM EIS?
Seems a needed position..


Muhahaha

Res Judicata

quote:Originally posted by Res Judicata

Outlaw, I dont think you know much about TW, or you are 100% script user or whatever, but to REMOVE the ability to USE COMMS and HOLD WARP LOCKS is just too big a change to get over.



Excuse me, but it is not that I don't know much about TW. (Lets look beyond TW for a awhile). The real fact here is people hate change, especially when something gives them an advantage (and that can be everything from life to budgets, etc.) and that was the point I was trying to make. Things change, people change, life changes, etc. Everybody at some point needs to accept change (The Globals issue has no bearing here, as I was not really picking on them either, or you for not liking the way they are now in my previous post).

As far as the globals are concerned, feel free to play on a .55 server (as that wasn't my point earlier) as I am sure JP will figure out something else for the next revision. I wasn't knocking you, or anybody for that matter, or the fact that globals don't work the way they use to, in the previous post that I made.

Hey Res I think you've made a good case for globals at some prompts for your gameplay. How do others rate these?

Also, not everyone is going to upgrade to .56 because of this. I think there will be plenty of .55 servers left. Hopefully in the meantime the community will come to more of a consensus as to where globals are/aren't needed, and this can be fixed a bit better in the next release.

ITs all GOOD at least JP is on the JOB, hes been interacting in a different part of the forum....

I hope I didnt stir up too much trouble.

Thankful JP is working on the game.

WE DO NEED TO REMOVE BUGS, however the LIST of bugs are some times considered normal part of game play. I would like to see list of PLANNED CHANGES as well as BUGS that are being abused in older versions...etc...so peeps will be more inclined to upgrade and run better games/systems.

Res Judicata

quote:Originally posted by rompca

Hey Res I think you've made a good case for globals at some prompts for your gameplay. How do others rate these?

Also, not everyone is going to upgrade to .56 because of this. I think there will be plenty of .55 servers left. Hopefully in the meantime the community will come to more of a consensus as to where globals are/aren't needed, and this can be fixed a bit better in the next release.


I support JP's decision to remove globals if they were causing a lot of game killing bugs like ptorping the Stardock. I hope that he adds in the comms and who's online at various command prompts so the scripts do not break anymore in 57.

The game is unplayable if someone holds a lock on a player or sector and the player that hits that sector is going to get nailed. I do not see sitting in the same location of the game waiting for an event to be playing, it is more like hunting and waiting for a duck to fly in front of your shotgun before you pull the trigger instead of searching for the duck or using bait to pull the duck towards you so you can aim and then pull the trigger. That is just my opinion. This solution breaks scripts and prevents players from staying online for hours at a time looking to kill people. So it takes away some of the advantages to the experts and makes it more fair for the newbies. They can still hit AY5000^M to attack a newbie in the same sector with a macro or typing it in real fast. Most newbies move really slow anyway.

Or re-write the script to sit at the command prompt, and then listen for "Dumbbunny entered sector 1234 on..." messages and have the script do a 1234^MYAY5000^M or whatever to TWarp in and then attack Dumbbunny with 5K figs. Also hit "#" every few minutes to stay online.

"I support JP's decision to remove globals if they were causing a lot of game killing bugs like ptorping the Stardock."

- globals do not have anything to do with this bug.


"The game is unplayable if someone holds a lock on a player or sector and the player that hits that sector is going to get nailed."

- of course the game is playable. people have been playing the game for years now. i dont know of anyone with skill who just sits and locks on a sector for hours at a time waiting for some poor newbie to hit it so he can twarp/beam/pwarp in to kill them. killing newbies takes relatively little skill because newbies do stoopid things.


"This solution breaks scripts and prevents players from staying online for hours at a time looking to kill people."

-you obviously do not know what you are talking about. please stop.


"So it takes away some of the advantages to the experts and makes it more fair for the newbies."

-the changes are not intended to 'even the playing field'. any perceived advantage that skilled players have against newbies is sipmly a result of time/effort/commitment, not game mechanics. are you socialist? maybe i should give you some of my paycheck because you don't have the skill to earn as much money as i do?


"Or re-write the script to sit at the command prompt, and then listen for "Dumbbunny entered sector 1234 on..." messages and have the script do a 1234^MYAY5000^M or whatever to TWarp in and then attack Dumbbunny with 5K figs. Also hit "#" every few minutes to stay online."

-scripts have NOTHING to do with these changes. hello? hello? hello? of course people can write scripts to deal with any game changes, and the newbies will still complain; the point is that removing game messages is an arbitrary move without any positive benefits - allowing newbies to live longer is not a benefit, and more importantly, is a false hope. i can guarentee that you will live no longer against me than you do now with the proposed changes.

EIS needs to restrict posts from people who have no clue what they are talking about. Yes Orion, I'm talking about you. Shut the hell up.